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How many miles are too many...?

eporter123
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eporter123

eporter123

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Hi, just found this forum and I've been reading a bit. I think the general "complaints" about the TC come from us spoiled American Drivers with huge SUVs/pickups and such. The euro-design of the TC is great, if you "get" it. I'm also digging the TC as you can get a camper top put on here in Portland by Ursa Minor/eCamper. Our current car is a Honda Fit, it's amazing what we've been able to get in there for weekend trips. Commuting solo in a quad-cab pickup? C'mon! Anyways, I'm glad to see this vehicle appreciated here! We added a Highlander to our fleet, but it was totaled by a drunk driver on New Years Eve. Fortunately we weren't in it, but now we need a new car. And it needs to fit two car seats...

 

I test drove a 2014 TC Passenger XLT this weekend. Great vehicle! I appreciate the utility, economy, and overall package. But... it's got 160k on it. Some kind of corporate fleet vehicle. $10,000. I'm guessing I'm just asking for problems with something like this?

 

There was a 2016 TC Passenger Titanium here, with 66k that just sold for $14500. That would've probably been worth the extra $4500?

 

So with the standard issues on these, what's a good mileage range to not be afraid of if the price is decent?


 

 

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eporter123

eporter123

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Hmm, I did not know that. I guess 150k is a much longer "vehicle lifetime" now than in years past.

 

My main concern at that mileage is engine/transmission replacement. But there is also considerable wear on everything else. At $10,000 I don't think it's worth the savings. I'm not sure at what price point it would be? There are a couple 2016s in town for around $16k with 30k miles on them. 60% more expensive than the 10k car, but probably worth it for repair savings?

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Fifty150

Fifty150

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On 1/14/2019 at 12:00 PM, eporter123 said:

 

 

I test drove a 2014 TC Passenger XLT this weekend. Great vehicle! I appreciate the utility, economy, and overall package. But... it's got 160k on it. Some kind of corporate fleet vehicle. $10,000. I'm guessing I'm just asking for problems with something like this?

 

 

 

 

 

Fleet vehicle may have been properly maintained.  Fleet Service programs are usually on top of whatever it takes to keep the vehicle running safely.  Basics.  Oil change.  Brakes.  Tires.  Lights.  

 

Although I suspect that @ $160,000 miles, you will be the one left with all the wear items with 160,000 miles worth of wear.....suspension, axles, exhaust leaks.  And some maintenance items which Fleet Service skips unless needed......Radiator flush, coolant exchange, brake & steering fluid, transmission flush, spark plugs, air filter, wiper blades........  It could still be a good car.  Just know what you are getting into, and weigh that against cost of ownership.  You don't want to pay $$$XXX, only to have spend $$$XXX on repairs.  

 

If this is at a dealership, use that as your bargaining chip.  Make them an offer, which will include having all deferred maintenance items addressed.  Let them fix everything, before you buy it.  At that mileage, I would surely be concerned about the transmission, axles, front end, and suspension.  Have them include a tune-up with new spark plugs & coils.  Make them flush the cooling system and transmission.  See if you can get them to include as much as possible.  This is a used car, with high miles, that they do not benefit from keeping on their lot.  

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Fifty150

Fifty150

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With Transit Connect, there will not be a shortage of used vehicles coming to the market.  Ford sells 30,000 - 40,000 of these every year.  Mostly fleet sales.  Those fleet vehicles will be up for sale.  If you really want to buy a used Transit Connect, have patience.  Keep looking, and you will find 1 with reasonable pricing, decent maintenance record, and in a condition acceptable to you.  

 

Shopping online is your best resource.  You can find something halfway across the country, and possibly negotiate transportation as a condition of sale.  It's almost common practice these days for people to buy cars and ship them.  carmax.com has a nationwide inventory.  Lots of cars are sold on eBay.  carguru.com , autotrader.com , https://www.enterprisecarsales.com

 

A lot of resources.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Beta Don

Beta Don

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Thank you 150, for another one of your posts which takes up several FEET of my computer screen  -  I'm sure he's interested in ALL of those examples

 

Golly, I'm glad I don't live on the West Coast  -  Prices there are a bit ridiculous!!

 

For comparison, I bought our 2014 TC from a dealer in Georgia almost 3 years ago with 12,000 miles on it and paid $15K.  It's an XLT with leather and had never been sold.  Sat on the dealers lot for more than a year and then they titled it and used it as a dealer loaner vehicle for a year, so when I bought it, it still had 2 years of the 3 year, 36K warranty remaining

 

How many miles are too many?  That really depends on how it was used and serviced.  There have been Gen 2 transmission failures on vehicles well short of 100K miles . . . . which has caused many of us to begin servicing our 'lifetime' transmissions early on  -  A fluid change every 25K or so

 

I know I wouldn't be interested in one with 160K on the clock and especially NOT at $10K   -  I much prefer to buy really low mileage vehicles for $10K off the sticker price and let someone else eat the depreciation, while I put on most of the miles

 

Don

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herb

herb

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1 hour ago, Beta Don said:

Thank you 150, for another one of your posts which takes up several FEET of my computer screen  -  I'm sure he's interested in ALL of those examples

 

Golly, I'm glad I don't live on the West Coast  -  Prices there are a bit ridiculous!!

 

For comparison, I bought our 2014 TC from a dealer in Georgia almost 3 years ago with 12,000 miles on it and paid $15K.  It's an XLT with leather and had never been sold.  Sat on the dealers lot for more than a year and then they titled it and used it as a dealer loaner vehicle for a year, so when I bought it, it still had 2 years of the 3 year, 36K warranty remaining

 

How many miles are too many?  That really depends on how it was used and serviced.  There have been Gen 2 transmission failures on vehicles well short of 100K miles . . . . which has caused many of us to begin servicing our 'lifetime' transmissions early on  -  A fluid change every 25K or so

 

I know I wouldn't be interested in one with 160K on the clock and especially NOT at $10K   -  I much prefer to buy really low mileage vehicles for $10K off the sticker price and let someone else eat the depreciation, while I put on most of the miles

 

Don

 

I agree Don , i shake my head when i read people purchasing vehicles with 100 + K miles for 8 to 12 K,  it just boggles my mind .  If i bought used it would have to be a vehicle with 30,000 miles or under in pristine shape .

 

Thats what i did with a mint condition 1990 Mustang GT , it had every option and 30,000 miles on it , the thing was babied , i bought it for $8K , sold it for 5K 3 years later .

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PhotoAl

PhotoAl

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Welcome to the forum.  You didn't say anything about injuries from the crash so presume ya'll are all OK.

 

I find patience is a valuable tool when looking at TC's.  I bought mine over a year ago and wound up buying a new 2016 in November of 2017.  The dealer came off over $7,000 so to me the difference between a nice CPO or CarMax used and the one I bought was not that great.  It is a 3rd vehicle for us and we use it for hauling people, stuff and grandkids.  It fantastic for elderly or people who have difficulty getting around.  It is a unique vehicle that a lot of people, particularly reviewers, just don't get.  It's not fast except when compared to my Honda Metropolitan, but it goes well enough.  IF a dealer has a left over 2018 you could probably get a good deal on one.  There might even be a 2017 floating around somewhere.  Mine came from a dealer 300 miles away, I drove a VW Rabbit up and traded it in and got a reasonable amount for it.  I have found Car Gurus to be a helpful site when searching for vehicles.  My son recently bought a Focus ST that I fond thru them.  Thru the Ford website you can see what local dealer inventories are, they limit you to a small distance around a zip code so you have to figure out the zip code for where you want to search and use that.  On CarMax it seems like the mileage on a vehicle doesn't make that much difference and even the model year doesn't have as much impact as Id expect.  

 

If possible I would try and avoid higher mileage vehicles.  For the TC a possible weak point is the transmission.  The fluid is supposedly lifetime but like a number of other vehicles it is not a lifetime fluid.  Changing the fluid on a regular basis is the key to getting a good service life out of it.  For example the 2008 VW Rabbit automatic (a Japanese unit) was sold with lifetime fluid.  But the fluid doesn't last the lifetime and should be changed every 50,000 to 60,000 miles.  My TC only has 13,000 miles on it and has been trouble free.  It is pretty quiet and the only annoying thing is the rattle from the car seats for the grandkids.  Its ride is not as smooth or plush as the Honda Odyssey that my daughter has but that costs much more and is a good bit bigger without the headroom.  Bought a 60" TV for mother-in-law the other day.  It fit in upright with the rear seats folded down.  It does handle very nicely and I'm continually surprised at how well it goes around corners.  My other car is a Volt and what is surprising is how little the difference in footprint is between the two.  My garage is tight with space at a premium so a small vehicle is nice.  Wife's car is a Smart Car which shares space with a motorcycle and 3 scooters!  She drove a GMC Safari van for many years hauling our 4 kids around and had seen the Smart cars in Europe.  When they made the announcement they were importing them she immediately put down a deposit.  Her second choice was a Fit.  When I was getting over knee surgery due to a scooter crash she drove me around in the Smart car - surprisingly it was very easy to get in and out of even with a leg that would not bend.

 

 

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Fifty150

Fifty150

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3 hours ago, PhotoAl said:

 IF a dealer has a left over 2018 you could probably get a good deal on one.

 

 

I'm sure that there are leftovers from last year.  That's with every car.  I can't think of any car where they don't have a few leftovers.  

 

 

 

 

3 hours ago, PhotoAl said:

 The fluid is supposedly lifetime but like a number of other vehicles it is not a lifetime fluid.

 

Every car sold with lifetime fluid proved that there is no such thing as lifetime fluid.  Everyone has heard of the Mercedes sealed, lifetime transmission.....which failed miserably.  Just about every one of those developed problems once the fluid was contaminated.  Yet, Mercedes, Toyota, Ford...they all sold cars with "lifetime transmission fluid".  My 07 pickup truck came with the 4 speed Ford transmission, which was also suppose to be lifetime.  A decade+ later, every "lifetime" 4RXXX transmission from Ford has proven that it's not lifetime, and requires service.  Then they all eventually fail, and need to be rebuilt or replaced.  

 

 

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WillMartin

WillMartin

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The funniest (to me) lifetime no-maintenance item was the shaft drive on BMW motorcycles.  BMW decided that they had engineered the perfect system and included no drain or filler on the shaft drive.  60K miles later, there were a whole lot of BMW touring bikes with failed shaft drives.  BMW never admitted that it was an issue, but they did start putting drain and filler plugs on those again.  German engineers are always right, y'know.

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Fifty150

Fifty150

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1 hour ago, WillMartin said:

 German engineers are always right, y'know.

  Some people believe that your car, or every car, was engineered to perfection.  They will insist that you not modify anything.  I remember adding a transmission cooler to my pickup, and this guy at the dealership insisted that it would cause "over cooling".  Same guy insisted that the transmission pan with the drain plug would cause me to lose my lifetime fluid.  Yes, genius!  That's the idea.  I want to get rid of the fluid.  You're suppose to change transmission fluid.  Not drive until it's contaminated & your transmission falls apart.  Remind yourself always, that a service advisor is not a technician.  

 

I'm still wondering about Korean engineers building a Hyundai with a 10 year / 100,000 mile warranty.

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Klingon

Klingon

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I just got a 2013 XLT 5-seat w/ 72/300 mi. for $8500 USD.   Used car dealer.......and he took my trade in F350 Lariat Crew Cab diesel which had a leaking radiator and a million other small problems too expensive to be worth fixing.   Lower mileage  was what I was gunning for in my new TC.  My other target was a 2012 5-seater w/ 69,000 that sold before I could get to it....private party....$9000.   While there was definitely not a shortage of TC's in central fl., 95% seemed to be the cargo version....and I needed seating for 3.  So my targets were very limited....kind of made TC hunting simple for me.  But in my search I found lots of TC cargos w/ 140,000-220,000 still on the road.  Basic maintenance and driving like an old man goes a long way.  The 2.0 engine in the 2010-2013 is admittedly weak. In the hands of the wrong person I could see the gas pedal being jammed to the floor far too often and engine life shortened. But of course you often don't know much about a used vehicle's previous owner or maintenance most of the time.  Mine didn't even come w/ an owner's manual or spare tire let alone maintenance records.  My TC's previous owner was female.  Women and old dudes tend to not beat the hell out of their cars.  Something to look for.  

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PhotoAl

PhotoAl

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Thats a good deal.  I would change the transmission fluid, brake fluid and oil but otherwise cars today are much more reliable than they used to be.  Today I think if a vehicle doesn't make it to 200,000 something is wrong.  If you ask the question why is a vehicle traded in?  There are lots of reasons but if someone like a vehicle they usually keep it for a while.  May be good logic to vehicles with some miles on them being traded for a newer one not because they are problematic.  Lower mileage may be fleet or leased who knows, just my thoughts.

 

LOL, I think I qualify as an old dude but up until last summer my primary vehicle beside the TC was a Kawasaki Ninja that could do 160.  I never had it there but did have the throttle twisted all the way around many many times :-) No I'm not going to say how fast it went with me on it.  I've had more shocked looks when I stop somewhere and took off my helmet, people were expecting a 20 something not a balk guy with grey hair.  

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Fifty150

Fifty150

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3 hours ago, PhotoAl said:

 I would change the transmission fluid, brake fluid and oil

 

 

Do all the maintenance.  Just like with every used car, assume that it wasn't done by the previous owner.  Recharge the air conditioning.  Spark plugs and coils.  Air filter.  Fuel filter.  Coolant.  Tires.  Get a new tree on the mirror.  

 

I bet you just cut your fuel bill in half.  I know that it's a huge difference in fuel cost between my F-150 & Transit Connect.   I suspect that your F-350 was just as bad, if not worse, in mileage.  My F-150 average mileage is about 14 MPG.  Only problem is that with my driving style, and California ReFormulated Fuel, my Transit Connect is falling short of the EPA estimate on the new car sticker.  A lot less.  I've seen mileage as low as 14 MPG on a tank.  My best tank was about 22 MPG.  My average as per fueleconomy.gov is 18 MPG.  But such is life.  I've never gotten the EPA estimate on any car I've owned.  

 

On my ex's Acura, the EPA highway is 26 MPG.  I installed a K&N air filter, tune up with NGK ignition parts, bolted on an aftermarket exhaust, changed engine oil & transmission fluid to boutique brand synthetic......then we took a road trip 1,500 miles.  The average MPG for that road trip was 28 MPG.  Not exactly cost effective to see 2 miles per gallon on the freeway.  We lived in The City.  All of our day to day driving was in city commute traffic.  No improvements in city traffic.  

 

By the way, I have the K&N filter in the Transit Connect.  It doesn't gain anything by way of performance or mileage.  I suspected that much before installation. For me, it was just so I wouldn't throw away all of those paper air filters.  Average cost of a paper air filter for the Transit Connect is about $20.  K&N filter is about $40.  My math has me ahead in not throwing away $20 bills.  

Edited by Fifty150
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WillMartin

WillMartin

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On 2/12/2019 at 9:24 PM, PhotoAl said:

Thats a good deal.  I would change the transmission fluid, brake fluid and oil but otherwise cars today are much more reliable than they used to be.  Today I think if a vehicle doesn't make it to 200,000 something is wrong.  If you ask the question why is a vehicle traded in?  There are lots of reasons but if someone like a vehicle they usually keep it for a while.  May be good logic to vehicles with some miles on them being traded for a newer one not because they are problematic.  Lower mileage may be fleet or leased who knows, just my thoughts.

 

LOL, I think I qualify as an old dude but up until last summer my primary vehicle beside the TC was a Kawasaki Ninja that could do 160.  I never had it there but did have the throttle twisted all the way around many many times ? No I'm not going to say how fast it went with me on it.  I've had more shocked looks when I stop somewhere and took off my helmet, people were expecting a 20 something not a balk guy with grey hair.  

My TC was indeed a fleet vehicle.  Monterrey County California owned it.  It had just over 23K miles on it when I got it.  There were plenty of scuffs in the interior and some ugly dents that I'll eventually fix all of, proving that if you don't own it, you don't necessarily care very much.  But, it was mechanically perfectly maintained.  I still changed all the fluids except the transmission fluid.  That's going to get changed next time I change the oil.  It ran a little rough when I got it, probably from sitting.  It seems to like being run more, since it has smoothed out noticeably since I got it.  I have put just over 2K on it in four months, so it's not like I'm turning it into a high mileage vehicle in any hurry.

 

I am a year from officially qualifying as an old dude, and I drive the van like an old dude.  The Daytona 675 does an indicated 170, and I have gone that fast on it.  On the track.  I won't admit what I may or may not have done and may or may not still do on a public road.  The bike was made for that.  The van was made to poke along in the slow lane.  It isn't all that much fun to drive anyway.  Better than the full sized van it replaced, but it's no sports car.

Edited by WillMartin
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WillMartin

WillMartin

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I just got 28 mpg on a fairly long trip out of town and back.  That included some stop and go.  I think my TC would get close to 30 mpg if I was ever to get on the freeway and set the cruise control for 60 mph and just putt along.  I will probably drive to Los Angeles one of these days, and will find out then.

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Fifty150

Fifty150

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On the F-150, I have a ScanGauge II.  Instant data.  I can see that driving 55, compared to driving 75, means real time MPG of +4, and a 30 degree Fahrenheit transmission fluid temperature difference.  18 MPG on the freeway vs 14 MPG.  210 degree vs 180 degree.  This is not a stock vehicle.  Many mods, including a 6" lift, + oversized wheels & tires which tend to lower MPG and raise transmission temps.  

 

I suspect that the Transit Connect may yield similar results.  Instead of 23 MPG on the freeway; I could see 27 MPG.  But I just can't drive in the No. 4 lane, as senior citizens in a Prius are passing me and giving me the finger.  

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WillMartin

WillMartin

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I'm not quite a senior citizen, and my wife has a Prius.  Going slow in the right lane and getting flipped off by old ladies doesn't bother me.  They flip me off for other reasons when I'm on the motorcycle.  No such thing as a happy medium in my world.

 

When I turned 50, my son told me I was officially a geezer.  He's got a year to come up with another one for when I turn 60.  Then he's really got to work on it for 65 and 70.

Edited by WillMartin
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Beta Don

Beta Don

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On 2/23/2019 at 7:27 PM, Fifty150 said:

I suspect that the Transit Connect may yield similar results.  Instead of 23 MPG on the freeway; I could see 27 MPG. 

 

I'm certain you could.  On my 2014 with the cruise set at 60 to 65, I consistently get better than 27 . . . . and no one flips me off

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G B L

G B L

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11 hours ago, WillMartin said:

When I turned 50, my son told me I was officially a geezer.  He's got a year to come up with another one for when I turn 60.  Then he's really got to work on it for 65 and 70.

When that happens, you can look at him and say with a smile " You are looking in the Mirror!"

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