Locking lugnuts....

[batman]

Hi all, 

 

has anyone lost lost their key/socket for removing the locking lug nuts? 

 

Is their an easy path forward? 

 

Bought the tc used, the key is missing and no one is claiming responsible. The dealer(s) say its aftermarket which the Internet says they are not. Sold as is, so they don't feel like dealing with it. Tires changed prior to previous owner trading in- Costco says "we have a box of those keys- just come down and see if yours is here" but they are 5-6 hrs away.

 

So fare the g/f has taken this to several tire shops with no luck. The dealer(s) are clueless which blows my mind. They indys offer to drill out the stud. They tried welding to the nut after breaking off the alloy acorn, no luck. Dealership says we would need some code to replace it and that takes weeks. And we have no code...

 

Space between the locking nut and rim is too tight for any standard socket or removal socket to get in there. So any tool needs to be specific or real close tolerances. 

 

Thoughts? Mysterious tools I'm overlooking? Black magic?

 

...anything???

 

thanks, it's really frustrating and although this is to put winter tires on...if it were a flat I'd be beside myself at this point...

 

dan

[DonShockley]

After trying to help a guy several years back who was stranded with a flat and no key, I swore I would never use locking nuts. When I saw them on my TC prior to purchase I made sure to make replacing them part of the deal and forced the dealership to be the ones to do the swap.

 

I still have the Ford locking nuts and key stored away. I've kept them to pass on to the next owner in case they are fans of locking lug nuts since my TC came with upgraded wheel options. If you can take a photo of you lugnut I can see if it looks like a match and can let you borrow the key to try on yours if it is.

[batman]

Thank you, kind sir!

 

The image with the cap is what they look like prior to attempting to remove with a universal lug nut socket (for those who might be interested in this tread and not sure if it applies to them). As you can see in the "without" picture, the cap (which actually has a stainless sleeve over it) has been broken off in the process. Looking at how little metal actually holds that cap on, and the type of metal, I'm guessing this is what they intend to happen when trying to circumvent the proper tool.

 

Best I can figure based on some Euro websites, ford uses colors to designate the different patterns for these sockets. Several people mention an "orange" or "yellow" paint blotch either on the plastic bag the tool comes in or on the tool itself.

 

It's really tight in there between the lug nut and the rim well...and it's just about too far recessed to weld though I think the dealer tried to do that at one point...it didn't stick.

 

Thanks a bunch for checking...

 

Dan

 

 

 

 

[batman]

DonShockly,

 

Also, if I can ask, could you measure the outside diameter of the locking lug nut please? The OD of the widest portion.

 

If I need to make some sort of tool, that would be super helpful in getting me a parent tool to manipulate.

 

Thanks again!

 

dan

[desert_connect]

If it were me I'd use a thin wall 12pt socket of the correct size, which there is enough room for. Use a dremel tool or die grinder to remove the points not applicable until you can drive it on with a hammer. It will probably only will take one or two interlocking points with the lug nut to be successful.

[dinocarsfast]

I have used things such as these;

locking lugnut removal set

 

these tool sets work well, its like a reverse threaded nut that when you spin the socket CCW it tightens down and grips the lugnut

 

or you could try the 12 point socket and hammer it on like this

[batman]

Thanks desert... and dino...

 

Yeah, my efforts will likely go down the 12 point socket route if i can find one in the area of the correct size. Grinding off the unnecessary points is a good plan.

 

I can't seem to locate a lug nut removal tool big enough to get close to the OD of these lug nuts. The ones that get close are super thick walled and I might be able to grind the outside down a but to make it fit.

 

At this point, It's not likely going to be an simple or pretty removal. With just a little more space this would be simple.

 

Kudos to Ford, these things aren't meant to come off without the tool...so much so that three dealers have turned me away at the premium rate.

 

Thanks for the tips all!

 

Dan

 

[G B L]

If you Take a 3/16 Drill (Cobalt is the best)  Drill two holes at  180 Degrees from each other   You will be able to split the nut with a narrow chisel.Then it will spin off with some snap ring pliers. 

The other Lug nuts  are also sleeved in Stainless  and if you live in a part of the country that uses salt or Mag Chloride you want to get rid of those also as the rust build up between the sleeve and the nut will make the tire change a very trying  operation at some point .

[DonShockley]

15 hours ago, batman said:

DonShockly,

 

Also, if I can ask, could you measure the outside diameter of the locking lug nut please? The OD of the widest portion.

 

If I need to make some sort of tool, that would be super helpful in getting me a parent tool to manipulate.

 

Thanks again!

 

dan

Unfortunately, it looks like mine have a different pattern. But here's photos with measurements of the Ford OEM nuts and removal tool. It looks like the cap is already off. One possible solution would be to use an oscillating tool to cut a slot in the end of the nut and use a very large screwdriver or flat bar stock to get it off.

 

[AVguy2]

To the OP that definitely looks like the OEM Ford supplied locks. It is also used on the spare tire (at least on mine) which might be easier to get to if you need to bring something to a dealer. I would "hope" that based on the VIN a Ford dealer should be able to order a replacement tool as it is much like a key. They should know what the TC shipped with.

 

If the tires are new and the locks are in place I would go to the Costco (where tires were installed?) and definitely look at what tools they have in a box. Sound like their installers are careless with those tools if they have a box of them. I would hate to get a flat after buying tires from them...

Edited December 4, 2017 by AVguy2

[batman]

Thanks everyone.

 

I managed to get them off this evening and my only real complain is that after the sun went down it dropped into the low 20s. 

 

So...here is what I did:

 

I stopped by Napa after work and picked up a 1 1/16 12 point socket (Evercraft CR-V). They let me take several SAE sockets out and see which one got me the parent tool to manipulate. I decided on the 1 1/16 as i figured it would be easier to grind the outside of the socket rather than the inside. I ended up grinding both so maybe you could get by with a 1 inch 12 point too. You'd just be grinding the inside of the socket more as the outside was the right diameter to slip inside the lug nut recess.

 

The 1 1/16 is 35mm wide. It looks like you need it around 32mm to slip in the aluminum rim lug nut recess. 

 

I ground the outside down with the flat side of an angle grinder cut-off disk. Worked pretty well and was pretty quick.

 

Then I took a dremel with a quarter inch grinding stone and rounded out the pointy recesses opposite the 12 points (refer to the pics attached). This basically opened up the inside some and made the 12 points a slight bit sharper, but smaller.

 

I played around a bit making sure not to take off to much as I was certain that these were not going to come off easy and I'd be applying some real torque to them.

 

I tapped the socket onto the locking lug nut, the one with the acorn cap broken off and welding residue, and applied some slow torque with a 3 foot 1/2 inch breaking bar. The first attempt slipped right off the lug nut. I tried again after pounding it on a bit harder...I had the first one off pretty quick. i inspected the socket as it's pretty thin and didn't want to split it. The second, which also had the acorn busted off, had a slightly tighter lug nut recess so back to the angle grinder. After that, the second one came off with a bit more pressure.

 

The last two still had the acorn caps on them which I determined were mentally getting in the way of the socket (they really should not) so I used a 8 point 3/4 to pull off the stainless sleeve and a 12 point 3/4 to break off the cap itself. 

 

Then I repeated the process: tap on the modified socket enough to feel like i got about 1/8 of bite and slow pressure with the breaking bar. Both came off equally as easy but I really feel the breaking bar was applying some real solid torque.

 

Anyway, I hope this helps someone. looking back, this isn't super hard but there isn't much room to work. None of the "thin-walled" sockets I tried were usable but possibly investigating metric sockets would be worth it.

 

Thanks again everyone. 

 

[Fifty150]

[Hipnoz]

Great Stuff here but I still have a problem.  WHERE IS THE TOOL IN THE CAR!

 

I just took delivery on a 2019 Titanium and noticed these locks a few days ago.  When you combine the capped lug nut issue with this locking lug nut you have a problem in my opinion.  I have already ordered a complete set of replacement lug nuts, but I don't know where the socket is in the car to remove the locking one.  The dealer and I looked where the jack is stored and didn't spot it.  Any ideas?

[DonShockley]

3 hours ago, Hipnoz said:

....  The dealer and I looked where the jack is stored and didn't spot it.  Any ideas?

My 2015 had it in the glove compartment at delivery. Now it's in the compartment under the passenger's seat, along with all the lock nuts since I had the dealer order replacements as part of the sales deal and they took them off shortly after delivery.

 

It also doesn't really look much like a key. Here's photos of mine so you can see what you're looking for. (Assuming your  2019 is same as my 2015). I knew right away that I didn't trust thos little tiny ridges not to strip when I really needed them.

[Don Ridley]

The lock must be in the vehicle somewhere. Mine was in the glove box. Check the louvered panels in back. The dealers seem to be clueless about these. Here's info on how the dealer can but you a replacement.

 

Need urgent help with security wheel nut removal https://www.focusrs.org/forum/showthread.php?t=119688

[Hipnoz]

Thanks everyone!

 

I looked everywhere and couldn't find it.  I was talking to my wife and telling her my frustration and she said that she had something in her passenger side door lower compartment and it was in a plastic bag.  I walked fast back out to the car and found it.  Yeah!

 

I quickly started the process to replace all them thinking about would I remember where the key was if I had a flat tire. (probably not)  I went to Driven Products and ordered a complete new set of lug nuts and retired the whole set to a plastic bag.  It gives me some piece of mind.  They look better too.

[jrm223]

After reading this thread, I'm glad my 2015 XL didn't come with factory locking lug nuts. People tend to ask a lot of questions about my lug nuts, haha. Technically, you could even call them "locking" because you need a 4" deep socket to remove them. Now I just need some better looking wheels to go with them.

[Fifty150]

For anyone else in the future, who is looking this up, it looks like the entire set + key is available as a Ford Part.  
 

Worse case scenario is that you order the entire set from your dealership, just to get the key.  Which of course, is "BS", since any competent dealership should have an OEM locking lug nut key already in it's service bay, and those techs should also have a locking lug nut removal tool set from Matca, Snap On, or whatever tool truck sells to them.  Even more surprising that the service writer and/or tech could not walk over to the parts counter.   

 

I would imagine that every tire store, which installs wheels and tires, must have the proper tools for removing a locking lug nut without a key.  Come On!  This is a dealership.  Not Gomer's shade tree garage.  It's not like asking your cousin or brother in law, and getting the confused look and shrug of the shoulder.  And just about any Guido could buy a set off Amazon or eBay.  Absolutely no reason acceptable, why a dealership service bay does not have the correct tools to help you.  

 

  If you can't find the key, don't have your own special tool, and your local dealership is so bass ackwards that they don't have an OEM wheel lock key......go to a tire shop.  I would bet that even guys at corner gas stations have special purpose tools which would remove a locking lug nut.

 

[mdarren]

I'm using a Craftsman with double-ended. One end is for locking lug nuts and the other end is for stripped lug nuts.

[G B L]

There is another reason to change out the lug nuts.  The Oem nuts are steel nuts that have a stainless jacket which over time have rust issues.

[zalienz]

I had those locking lug nuts. After reading the horror stories here and elsewhere, I ordered standard lug nuts and ditched the locking nuts early on. Never looked back.

[OLDSCHOOLFOOL]

Is there a particular purpose to these locking nuts? Theft? I can't imagine anyone wanting to steal these ugly black stock wheels!?

[G B L]

The reason is theft, but the people likely to commit the theft will have a full set of lock nut removers !!

[Fifty150]

8 hours ago, G B L said:

the people likely to commit the theft will have a full set of lock nut removers !!

 

Ironic that the thieves can remove the nut, but Batman's dealership cannot.

 

On 12/3/2017 at 9:05 AM, batman said:

g/f has taken this to several tire shops with no luck. The dealer(s) are clueless which blows my mind.

 

[G B L]

I guess the crooks have more incentive!