Oil Change

[Beta Don]

My 'schedule'is to do the 13 quart dump and refill every 25,000 miles

We had a small Mitsubishi van years ago and it had a standard drain plug on the auto trans pan.  Every other 3K engine oil change,I would dump the trans and put in 2 1/2 quarts of new fluid  -  I think with the converter it held 7 quarts total, so about every 10,000 miles, we had changed the trans fluid.  I really liked that arrangement, but unfortunately very few manufacturers put a drain plug in the trans pan

Don

[G B L]

My rig just turned 51000mi, Will do the Trans flush soon.  Although you can't change the filter the trans drain plug makes the fluid change easy .  13 Qts will clear the fluid nicely . 

[BSUPC]

3 hours ago, G B L said:

Although you can't change the filter the trans drain plug makes the fluid change easy .  

Did they change this one the 2nd Gen ? I just done my flush and filter change a couple thousand miles ago on my 2012. Below is a look under the oil pan of the 2012 transmission. The big black plastic with the small yellow square in the middle is the filter on these. 

Edited June 25, 2017 by BSUPC
Added picture of under the trans oil pan.

[Beta Don]

The 6F35 Select Shift 6 speed transmission used in the Gen 2's is completely different from the 4 speed in your early model.  There isn't a transmission pan on the bottom that you can remove and the filter is buried deep within the trans so you cannot change it

Supposedly it's a 'Lifetime Fill' transmission which requires no maintenance during it's 'lifetime' but if you want it to last as long as your TC, everyone (including your Ford dealer) recommends fluid changes every 25 to 30K and since fluid changes are so much less expensive than trans rebuilds, it's a no-brainer in my book  -  I really hate to throw away money on something that regular maintenance can prevent  

Don

[BSUPC]

17 hours ago, Beta Don said:

'Lifetime Fill' transmission which requires no maintenance during it's 'lifetime' 

Not making fun of you Don, but this made me laugh so hard I fell out of my chair.  I love when they say something never needs maintenance. I guess this is the results you get when you try to take a work van and try to cater it to the soccer moms. Glad I got the 2012 now.   I really do not know much about the gen 2's. But if I ever have to get another work van I guess I will make the step up to the Transit instead.

 

Maintenance free. lol

[Beta Don]

I did lots of research before buying our TC  -  The big question I needed answers to was did I want the 2.0 with the 4 speed auto or the 2.5 with the 6 speed.  Hands down, that's a no-brainer, so we went shopping for a used 2014 or 2015 . . . . whatever we could get the best deal on  -  Once I did  the research, we never looked at a Gen 1

We cruise at 2250 RPM at 70 mph and the torquey 2.5 can pull it OK up most hills without down shifting to 5th.  6th is a true 'overdrive' as 5th at 70 mph gets you 3,000 RPM and at that RPM it will pull just about any grade without needing to downshift again

The fact that they advertise the transmission as 'maintenance free' is actually a good thing, IMO.  If they don't expect transmission problems for those who bought the Ford extended warranty and don't do any maintenance, imagine how reliable it will be for those of us who are doing regular fluid changes.  I do wish they had given us a dipstick to check the level though  -  The procedure we need to use is a bit labor intensive . . . . but then, it's only needed once every 25K

The 6F35 was jointly developed by Ford and GM and it's an awesome transmission in my opinion.  The ability to put it in any gear you like and keep it there has already come in very handy.  Also, if you have the cruise control set and go down a steep hill, the computer will downshift automatically for more engine braking so you never exceed the speed you have it set for  -  I love that feature.  I've never driven a better combination of small engine/transmission than the 2.5 mated with the 6F35.   I'm 100% happy with it.  I've driven several cars with small 4 cylinder engines mated to 4 speed transmissions and always found them lacking  -  You just need more gear ratios to get the best from small engines, even in small cars  -  Buying a 2.0 four mated to a 4 speed automatic in a 3500 lb van (maybe pulling a trailer, which we frequently do) would have left me kicking myself for not doing more research

Don

[mrtn]

CVT is the best for small engines, IMHO. They're getting more and more common as well as the technology has matured.

[Beta Don]

I would agree with you that the CVT is a good match for a small engine without lots of torque *if* it's in a small car that you won't use to tow anything.  It's an even more appealing idea if you regularly trade cars well before they see the 100K mark on the odometer, as even the latest, greatly improved versions have a history of failure before 100K miles. After the warranty expires, replacing it will be very costly  -  Many really good looking cars in the boneyard have failed CVT's and the replacement cost evidently wasn't worth it to the owner

I wouldn't want one in a heavier car, or with any engine which develops plenty of torque  -  You don't see them behind V8's and for good reason.  When they fail (not *if*) they usually cannot be rebuilt and replacing the trans typically runs between $3K and $5K USD.  I would not buy one in a TC if it was offered  -  Too heavy and towing 2,000 pounds with one would be an invitation to failure

Don

[mrtn]

15 minutes ago, Beta Don said:

When they fail (not *if*) they usually cannot be rebuilt and replacing the trans typically runs between $3K and $5K USD.

I once helped a guy compare the transmission configuration in my Toyota. His CVT belt blew due to lack of maintenance. He bought the car used and it had 280 000 km (175K mi) on the odo. He managed to source the original manufacturer of the transmission parts in China and got it running for a couple of hundred (did his own labor), including resurfacing the pulleys which got damaged by the belt chips. So it can be done and more so in the future when the novelty factor is gone.

[G B L]

They have been around for along time .In lots of things , as the quality of the materials  gets  cheaper and cheaper. The use of Cvt transmissions will rise.

Edited June 28, 2017 by G B L

[Timbo]

I'm glad I found this thread.  I couldn't find the oil change intervals in my owners manual and was going to change the oil/filter on my '10 TC today.  

Then I found my maintenance records and saw that my last oil change was only 4,000 miles ago.  

 

I'm glad I read the replies here before going outside and crawling under the van.  Looks like I can wait another 3,500 miles.  

[Fifty150]

After 2 years of owning this little wagon, I finally did the oil change myself.  The first oil change was at the dealership last June.  A few weeks ago, the oil change message displayed on my dashboard.  Since the first oil change was free at the dealership, this time, I actually had to go out to buy the oil & filter.  Since I can't leave well enough alone, I bought a Gold Plug magnetic oil drain plug.  

 

The first thing that I notice was that the FL-910S looked like a cut down version of the FL-400S.  The specs showed the same diameter and thread.  Since I already had some FL-400S filters in the garage, I knew that I would have to check it for fitment once I got the used filter off.  A little bit more filter, could mean a little bit more filtration.  Couldn't hurt, right?  I'm sure that the oil pump could handle it.  

 

 

I see that some people use oil change ramps.  Almost bought some, until I thought about how I already had a floor jack and jack stands, and that those ramps wouldn't be of much use for my tire rotations, flat repair, and brake service.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Fifty150]

The FL-400S installed perfectly, and there was plenty of clearance.  The Gold Plug drain plug fit just like the OEM.

 

I will never understand why those dealership guys torque on the drain plug and oil filter so tight, that you have to force them off.  

 

 

[Fifty150]

[Fifty150]

On 6/16/2017 at 3:29 PM, Beta Don said:

Very first oil change!

 

The oil fill cap on the 2.5 is in a bit of an odd place, to say the least.  It's back under the lip of the vent system which means you'll need to custom cut a funnel so you can get it in there.  

 

 

 

I used Castrol Edge 5W20 full synthetic and a Purolator Synthetic oil filter.  The oil comes in 5 quart jugs, so I bought two.  

 

 

Don

 

 

I used this funnel from Wal*Mart.

 

 

This time around, I used Castrol 6007 GTX MAGNATEC 5W-20 Full Synthetic Motor Oil, 1 Quart, 6 Pack .  $18.69 @ Amazon.

 

 

 

 

[Fifty150]

[mrtn]

That's the same oil Ford recommends in Europe, there's even Castrol logo on my oil cap.

[Fifty150]

Interesting.  Ford in Europe does not try to steer you towards their Motorcraft brand.  

 

I bought that oil because of pricing.  Very inexpensive for 6 qts of Full Synthetic.

[mrtn]

Everything else is Motorcraft branded, always has been. This Castrol oli may very well be the OEM for Motorcraft brand and they decided not to renew the license deal.

Edited May 29, 2018 by mrtn

[Beta Don]

I'm always very hesitant to use any other filter than the one the manufacturer recommends  -  There's lots more going on inside the filter other than how many square inches of filtration it has and I see nothing to be gained by second guessing the engineer who spec'ed the filter he thinks is best for HIS engine

 

But, there will always be those who think 'larger must be better' and/or who think they know more about this particular engine than the guys who designed it  -  I've seen these 'lets use a larger filter' threads in every automotive forum I've frequented over the past 25 years or so . . . . and now we have one here too!

 

Don

Edited May 29, 2018 by Beta Don

[Mike Chell]

8 hours ago, Fifty150 said:

The first thing that I notice was that the FL-910S looked like a cut down version of the FL-400S.  The specs showed the same diameter and thread. 

 

from the same manufacturer ... there's no problem with using a larger filter.  Buying "bargain" filters can DEFINITELY be a problem.

 

8 hours ago, Fifty150 said:

I will never understand why those dealership guys torque on the drain plug and oil filter so tight, that you have to force them off.  

 

My experience ... they DON'T over torque them.  They don't USE a torque wrench at all.

WAY too many mechanics think their wrists are calibrated.   

for those of you who're thinking, "mine is" ... no, it's NOT.

 

1 hour ago, Beta Don said:

I'm always very hesitant to use any other filter than the one the manufacturer recommends  -  There's lots more going on inside the filter other than how many square inches of filtration it has and I see nothing to be gained by second guessing the engineer who spec'ed the filter he thinks is best for HIS engine

 

But, there will always be those who think 'larger must be better' and/or who think they know more about this particular engine than the guys who designed it  -  I've seen these 'lets use a larger filter' threads in every automotive forum I've frequented over the past 25 years or so . . . . and now we have one here too!

 

Don

Don, 

I won't argue your opinion towards "larger must be better".  I tend to agree that the specified filter is sufficient, and larger isn't necessarily better ... especially if you're doing the oil changes on schedule.

However, I will argue that two filters, from the same manufacturer, designed for the same type engine (4 stroke vs. diesel) will both work within the specifications.  If a person is ... lacking ... on scheduled oil changes, the extra filter surface area of a larger filter might be useful.  As long as the smaller one is the specified size, the larger one will work just fine.  You wouldn't want to put a smaller one in place of a larger, though.  

 

The main problem with oil filters, is the sub-standard construction of aftermarket, budget priced filters.  Many of them just won't stay together through a long change interval.

[Beta Don]

There's lots more going on inside a filter than just how much filtration they offer.  Some filters have anti-drainback valves, some don't.  Some have pressure regulating valves, some don't.  Most have a pressure relief valve where it bypasses a clogged filter, but the pressure required to open that valve can vary from filter to filter, even ones from the same manufacturer.  There are very few filters which are exactly the same inside, except one has a bit more filter paper so when you change from the one spec'ed for your engine to one spec'ed for another, you very well might be changing something inside which was also spec'ed for your engine that you don't have anymore . . . . and what have you really gained?  If the engineers wanted a larger filter, they would have specified that.  I'm sure the filter size is probably twice as big as it really needs to be, assuming you're doing oil changes at the recommended interval

 

Don

[Mike Chell]

Opinions or experience.

 

Since I've had reason and opportunity to cut open filters over the years ... I'll stick with my experiences.

[PhotoAl]

I used to run some aftermarket filters but was always particular as to which ones.  Now I stick closer to the manufacture recommended.  Last year K&N had a run of motorcycle filters that would open up - separate base from can!  Not good on a motorcycle when it gets on the rear tire.  It was so bad many tracks outright banned K&N oil filters.  Seems like a lot of companies chase lower manufacturing costs but loose control of quality.  I’m about to change my TC oil for the first time and was contemplating Castro. Vs Mobile 1.  I run Castrol motorcycle oil in my Ninja which has a 16,000RPM redline and power get big at about 8,000RPM.  The first engine mechanical failure I’ve seen is my sons VW turbo which we found large metal flakes and a small screen in the oil pan hI refer to it as VW’s special oil additive).  Working on that makes me appreciate the underhood area of the TC.  

[mrtn]

1 hour ago, PhotoAl said:

I’m about to change my TC oil for the first time and was contemplating Castro. Vs Mobile 1.

 

There really is no difference there. Both exceed your engine’s requirements by a large margin. 

Edited May 29, 2018 by mrtn