windguy

Just want to clarify one point. If you order a new van, there's no reason to pay sticker price, or MSRP regardless of what you order. If you use a buying service, there are many available, you will pay far less than sticker. I think most programs have similar pricing agreements with the auto makers. In my case, I used Costco's auto buying program. Costco's program assigns you to a dealer based on your zip code that's enrolled in the program. You can switch dealers if needed. I did that. You are given a quote via email based on prearranged pricing structure between Costco and the dealer. I paid $100 less than dealer invoice. Not MSRP. If there are any Ford incentives available when your van is delivered, you can stack those for extra savings. The only caveat when ordering is that you can't time the delivery so it may not align with Ford incentives. My purchase didn't. I tried, but the offers expired. The dealer had no incentive to help me. I tried to take the Costco price to three other Ford dealers that were closer to me and none would match it. In fact, they were unresponsive via email because I'm guessing they knew they weren't going to get anywhere near this pricing. Whether you use the buying service or not, it gives you a starting price point to negotiate with. There is no cost to you to use the service. The dealer pays a fee to the service. There is no haggling with the buying service. Fixed pricing.

@sebestyen13 - Welcome to the forum and congrats on your new TC. I'm assuming you have a wagon version vs the cargo since you're transporting kids. Good place to start if you have a question is to use the SEARCH bar in the upper right corner of your screen. Very helpful. If you type "roof racks" you will see numerous threads covering this topic. Below is a link to a roof rack install I did on my cargo TC. You have a headliner in the cargo area so you have different considerations, but there are plenty of other posts covering wagon installs. Good luck!

Thanks for the reply. When I get back from the beach, I remove all wet gear and leave the driver's side slider open all the time in the garage. Still doesn't give me great air flow to the back area. Since the rust is just around those open holes in this one area, I agree with the post above that the paint is thin around the cutouts and leading to corrosion. The rest of the paint is just fine. Unless someone has a better suggestion, I will lightly buff back the rust with steel wheel and coat with some rust-oleum paint in a can. Buy some in gray to match the paint color. Doesn't have to be perfect. Brush it around the holes. Then I might consider covering the opening in this one area so they aren't directly exposed to the moisture. That barrier layer should do the trick. Hoping. I was gong to add some LED light on that ledge somehow so perhaps I'll do that as project. Thanks for the help!

No problem. I sent you a PM with some suggestions.

Thanks for the replies. You guys are spot on. See pic below. The windsurfing sails that I store in this area are put away wet but removed when I get home to dry out. Sometimes they don't dry all the way before putting back in the rack. Makes sense this is the source of the problem. Aesthetically I don't really care about the appearance of the rust but don't want it to 'grow' and turn in a problem. Any suggestions for remedies? I was thinking to first lightly remove the rust using something like steel wool since it's pretty flexible and not harsh. Then to apply some type of Rust-oleum paint that has rust inhibitors. Or I could get touch up paint from Ford parts to match the van color. Don't need very much paint to cover this area. I think with a good coat of paint along the edges I'll be rust free in the spot going forward. Thanks!

I've noticed a little bit of rust just inside the rear opening of the barn doors on my 2015 Cargo TC. See pics posted below. The rust is only in this one area as far as I can tell. Around the holes stamped in the rear panel at the top. No rust on the side holes. The van is mostly garaged and doesn't see very much rain but I do frequent the beach but there is no direct ocean spray. The gear I store right in this area does have salt water so moisture is close by or it is possible that it may brush it occasionally. Was wondering if any other Gen 2 Cargo owners also have this rust issue? Any remedies that I should consider or just let it go? Looks like this issue would not fall under Ford's paint warranty. My five year warranty is set to expire on 01/15/20. Hard to believe I've had the van for five years! https://firstquarterfinance.com/ford-paint-warranty/ Thanks!

@eliminatethis - that material looks just like the butyl mat material I used. Needs to be rolled out. Maybe they have different materials out now. What I meant by two layers is first layer of the 5-10mil silver type mat material that needs to be rolled out with a second layer over that of the 150mil foam padding to provide extra sound proofing and thermal insulation. A two layer approach that was recommended by Noico and Roadkill. Of course they want you to buy more product but it made sense to me to take the extra step.

@dincarsfast - Interesting. Not that I would ever do this, but curious, if you drill a new hole in the gas tank, what holds this tap in place?

@eliminatethis - Thanks for sharing. Nice work on the sound proofing. Removing all the headliners must have been a chore. I did the ceiling on my cargo van up to the rib in the cab area, not removing the headliner. Didn't want to open a can of worms. If you haven't put the headliner back yet, you might want to consider adding a recommended second layer of protection, which is what I did. It's a lot easier to install than the butyl mat material that has to be rolled out. Tough work working overhead, isn't? The material I used as a second layer was from Noico and is 150mil, black color, came on a roll. Looks like the link below but this shows a different company, Siless. They may be the same company with different badges. https://www.amazon.com/Sound-Deadening-Foam-157mil-Insulation/dp/B07B75PD8B/ref=sr_1_42?crid=3OQXKFFTG8C8C&keywords=noico+sound+deadening&qid=1576688792&s=electronics&sprefix=noico+%2Celectronics%2C413&sr=1-42 The best I can tell, the Noico product now comes in precut pieces, so something has changed. https://noico.info/products/noico-red-170-mil-36-sqft-car-waterproof-sound-insulation/

@kruss77 - Thanks for sharing. Great write-up and pics too. Smart that you drove it to a repair shop without delaying. Personally, I think the repair cost was a bargain. $53 parts and $90 labor, which you said took about an hour. That's about right. But also the tech quickly diagnosed the problem and fixed it correctly with no collateral damage, and you got back on the road in an hour. I put a lot of value in that. PS - Welcome to the forum. How about a few pics of your van? (if you haven't done so yet)

Ha! Same. See reference below. Would be nice to know where the mount is exactly. Pics would help. https://www.vibra-technics.co.uk/faq#I have seen the term “NVH” used. What does this mean? I have seen the term “NVH” used. What does this mean? NVH is a term in widespread use in the automotive industry used to describe the quality of noise and vibration inside a car. “Noise” and “Vibration” are measurable values but “Harshness” is very subjective. The purpose of an engine mounting system is to reduce NVH to an acceptable level. The ultimate goal is to make the running engine imperceptible to the driver and passengers. In reality this requires significant compromises in controlling engine movement and durability. Vibra-Technics engine mountings are designed to give excellent NVH performance without compromising engine control.

No, it's not normal. Since you have a cargo version, your problem is most likely the same as what I experienced. Refer to my post for service info. Please report back after you have the problem fixed.

@serviceplus - do you have a cargo van or wagon? Don S has a good memory - the link shows issues for both models. Mine is a cargo and it was missing a duct cover per my post on page 4. Solved the problem. Good luck!

@drwatt - Welcome to the forum and congrats on your new TC. The conversion looks wonderful. So many amenities. You're going to enjoy traveling with that rig. Looking forward to hearing about your adventures. Happy Veteran's Day - Thank you for your service and best of luck with your PD. Link below to an older post.

@double nickels - you and fifty150 should do a meet up since you both live in the bay area. Heck, maybe you both are in the same part of town. Even crazier on the same street. That'd be a coincidence, wouldn't it? It would be very cool to see a pic of both your TC's on the streets of SF.

That Curt model looks the same as what others have install and it sits below the existing bumper. It's a nice looking hitch. The only issue I recall is that its a bit more difficult to lower the spare tire but it's doable. I don't think you need to remove any of the original bumper or cover though I don't recall anyway adding the Curt with a stock hitch in place. That may be a problem. Worst case you can have a welder remove the receiver part of the OEM setup if you need that clearance. Just a thought. The Curt hitch won't provide any bumper functionality. You have to leave the original bumper/hitch combo in place or you won't have a required bumper and method to secure the bumper cove, unless you source a used non-hitch bumper from a salvage yard. Easy to find but probably expensive to ship so pickup might be required.

I have a factory trailer hitch on my 2015 cargo. Not sure if anything has changed with your Back to Future 2919 model, but when the factory hitch is installed the rear bumper is removed. The hitch becomes the fear bumper in addition to providing the hitch component. The bumper cover attaches to that assembly. If you were to remove the factory hitch, you would be without a rear bumper, yes? The aftermarket hitches like the popular Curt model that many forumites have installed mounts below the regular bumper assembly. When I got my van I looked into having a hitch shop reposition the receiver part because I felt it sticks out too much, but they wouldn't do any mods for liability reasons. What type of aftermarket hitch are you installing? There's been lots of discussions on several threads about adding weight to the back of the vehicle on hitches and trailers. You'd have to search the forum for those threads. IMHO, as a hitch mount carrier, I'd be careful adding anything more than a few bicycles to the back of the van. There has to be a weight limit as to how much you can hang off the back of the van, just like the tongue weight of a trailer, which I have no experience or guidance with.

I have a factory trailer hitch on my 2015 cargo and have never used it. I would not exclude a van with a hitch unless the hitch shows a lot of wear. A nicked up hitch could have been used just for a bike carrier, which shouldn't be a problem. Just a thought. That's leaving aside the fact that the factory hitch sticks out too far IMHO and you might clip your shins on a few times. Adding a cover helps with that somewhat.

@magnumtripod - are you asking about a plastic funnel that is used for filling the gas tank? Not sure what you mean by "horn"? Audible horn or something shaped like a horn. My funnel was in the glovebox when I got the van. Can you take a pic to share?

@magnumtripod - Congrats on your new van and welcome to the forum. The audible signal or beep is part of the parking sensor assist system. I have that on my 2015 Cargo, but it was an option that I ordered. Front and rear sensors. There is a switch on the 2015 to disable the rear parking assist in case you have a trailer that would affect the sensor. Does your 2019 have sensors in the bumper? Not sure if they made that a standard feature. I think backup cams are a requirement now, not sure on vans.

@marquizzo - bummer. sorry to hear the bad news. The rivet nuts are certainly an option but I'm not sure if this would be the best application because the hole would be much larger than optimal being oblong but I haven't thought it through all the way. You also have to be sure it's bulletproof because of the upward forces of the load on your racks. That's a big liability you can't exactly experiment with. Couple of thoughts come to mind. If you went with a five foot Yakima or Thule type track like I used and only use the rear four mounting holes, then you can reverse the mounting bolt so they point up and the nuts are on the outside. Assuming you can drop the head of the bolt into the oblong hole with a washer. Might be tricky to angle but possible. You can mount the bolts and washers using ample amounts of silicon, then remove the nut, which will stay in place because of the silicon, and then put down the track and put washer and nut on to tighten. Another option is to enlarge the front mounting hole so you can add the mounting hardware. Being careful about metal shavings dropping inside by using a shop vac as you drill the holes or whatever tool you use. Another idea is to just drop the headliner in just the cab area so you can get behind that one mounting hole. I know some forumites have dropped that headliner and don't think it's too difficult, but I wasn't willing to try that myself. You can also consult with Yakima or Thule directly or another rack installation place to get their input. Maybe they have different experiences or solutions. Worth a few phone calls. I got some of my parts from rackattack.com. How about the Turtle Roof Racks from Turkey? (thread below) How about the Rhino racks someone else used? (thread below) Same place that you went to - Rack 'n Road. Not sure if you went to the Costa Mesa location though. Keep exploring all options and doing your research. You'll get to a solution at some point. Always available here to bounce ideas off of. Good luck!

Got it, thanks. The Gen 2 door config is a bit different. I will need to remove the black plastic cover for the wipers to get to the pass through hose, which is up higher than your Gen 1. You've got a nice size panel to handle a larger speaker, 6 or 8" I'm guessing. The 4" round speakers I got have a shallow mounting depth, less than 1", and they are marine grade so moisture shouldn't be an issue. I tested the sound and it's okay. Hope being in a door cavity will improve that. BTW - Your pics are pretty nice too. That first one showing the mountains, which I presume is granite, is awesome.

@marquizzo - I think it's a very good idea visiting your local rack shop to see what solutions they offer. They have the experience that will save you time and money. The one reason I like the Yakima type rails is that on mine I used four mounting points. They do have special nut inserts when you want to mount them from the outside. They will show you this at the rack store. I like the idea of having a fender washer and nut on the inside but I understand about the headache of removing a roof liner. But for this shop it might be really easy for them to do. Those SUP's you have are very long. Sounds fun for cruising. What do you use now to transport them? Lakes, bays or ocean? You'll need to spread your cross bars apart as much as possible to balance that load and may have to opt for using the front mounting hole too. The rack shop will advise you on that issue. My windsurf and surfboards are all under 8ft (4 total) so they are more compact. A 4ft spread on the crossbars is more than adequate for them. You would need around 6ft. I've been mounting boards on cars, pickups and vans since 1984 so I've seen it all. My preference is to still stick everything inside if I can. See pic below. The racks are just a spare option for me. If I had a board that long it might be cool to have a roller on the back cross bar so you can easily hoist the SUP onto the rack if you're by yourself. Just a thought. It's nice that the Gen 2 TC has a reasonable roof height for loading but I guess that depends on our height. Random thoughts - Make sure your liftgate doesn't bonk anything hanging off the back of the rack. I have barn door so it's not an issue. If you store your van in the garage, the garage door opener needs to be stored away from it's normally mounting point when you have a load on the roof rack or else you're going to zone out and just hit that button and pull in forgetting about that load on top. Been there, done that. D'oh! Please keep us posted!

Thanks for sharing. Wonderful craftsmanship. Nice JOB! Cool looking dog too! I'm sure he/she thinks it's their van now and you're just the driver I like your sun/rain shade gizmo pulled over the barn doors. Good idea. I'm ready to mount speakers like you did in the rear doors. I have a Gen 2. Any issues I should know about that might help with my install?

The 5ft long rails are $159 list. A few times a year both Yakima and Thule have 20% off sales. Otherwise it's price fixed at list price. There are lower cost options too other than those companies. https://www.rackattack.com/base-roof-rack-systems/permanent-custom-mount-roof-rack-systems/yakima-60-inch-track-with-bolts/ https://www.etrailer.com/Roof-Rack/Yakima/Y01135.html Do you have a cargo van or wagon model? I would research how those CAN AUTO tracks installs and what your options are for cross bars. I wouldn't worry too much about load rating for a SUP but more about the lift forces when you get air under that at highway speeds. That could be significant say compared to a ladder. What length is your SUP? Someone on this forum a long time ago posted about mounting SUP's on their roof rack. You'll have to search for that post.