Beta Don

Here gasoline is around $2 per gallon while propane is about $2.75 - At least that's what I pay when I buy it in 200 gallon increments for home heating. Motor fuel propane isn't universally available - You can buy it in larger cities (many fleet vehicles use it) but if you were traveling cross country, it could be a bit hard to find. Not a very practical conversion over here Don

I hadn't read that thread - Thanks! Sure wouldn't work over here - We pay more for propane (even with zero road use tax on it) than we do for gasoline, so the 21 mpg would be a real killer Don

You have really engineered excellent answers to all of your objectives! I really like the way you have both an extra seat in the back, but then a flat surface for sleeping when you don't need the seat. It looks really nice and your construction shows real talent. It's going to be a completely different vehicle compared to what you bought and really easy to convert back to stock if need be. Thanks for posting all the details and the great photos. No doubt you're going to find a few others who would like you to re-work their vans! Don

So, your van is Propane powered? I noticed you have "1.6 LWB '16 (LPG)" listed under your name. Here, LPG (Liquified Petroleum Gas) is Propane - Same thing over there? How do you like the LPG? How does the mileage compare with gas? Where did they mount the tank? How long does it take to refuel? Don

Pretty sure all the 16" wheels are steel on the 2014 - 2016's. If you have stock alloys, I think they were all 17" . . . . at least here in the USA Don

We had the same dilemma when we were shopping for a van - 90% of the time we would prefer to have the extra space and no rear seating at all, but then there are times we would want to take our grandkids with us, so we didn't know what to buy. No Ford dealer sales rep knew ANYTHING about the seating in the SWB models. "Maybe you could unbolt the rear seats and take them out" We almost bought a cargo van and were thinking the same thing - Is there any way to jury rig in rear seating into a cargo van? I kept thinking it must be easier to take seats out than it would be to put seats in where there were no seats before. If the OP is trying to decide what to buy and needs both occasional seating for 5 and a flat floor for use as a work truck, the SWB models of the 2014 and newer TC's come with rear seats which are completely removable - Sadly, none of the sales people we talked to knew that . . . . we *almost* bought the wrong truck! Fold the back down flat, flip them up vertical (which gives you back about 75% of the floor space previously occupied by the seats without actually removing them) and then you can flip a pair of little levers and the rear seats lift completely out of the van - They have built-in handles for toting them around. The rear seat is a 60/40 design and you can take out either the larger one, the smaller one or both of them. Time to take them out is maybe a minute . . . . time to put them back in is maybe 2 minutes. They ARE a bit heavy (especially the larger one) but I'm no youngster and I can do it by myself Don

We have a 2014 SWB and while it's not long enough to stretch out full length to sleep, it's not impossible to use for sleeping by any means either. You can cut a foam mattress to fit it perfectly. The really nice thing about the SWB wagons is the second row seating comes out in just a minute or two and leaves a flat floor and the seats go back in nearly as fast . . . . I'm not sure it's that easy in the LWB model I would go check out both versions before deciding you couldn't live with a SWB When it comes down to the choice between 2013 and earlier and the 2014 and later, it's pretty simple - The 6 speed Select Shift automatic is what you want - Drive a '13 and then a '14 and you'll see what I mean Don

Europe also has a model without the side doors

Thanks for all the pretty pictures! Pick-ups are a uniquely American thing - You rarely see them in Europe (not that many in Canada either) and certainly never as a daily driver. When you're paying 6 or 8 bucks a gallon for gas, most people look for something more practical. Unless they had a daily need for hauling or towing, very few would even think of owning one - You do see all sorts of cars with trailer hitches there though. Small cars towing all sorts of trailers is very common and to be honest, for most of us who seldom need to haul things that won't fit in the car, a trailer is a solution which makes lots more sense. When we lived in Germany, I got a kick out of seeing a BMW pulling a trailer full of buckets of paint, ladders and painting supplies! Few families back then had two vehicles and he evidently didn't want to drive a truck for his everyday needs For the record, trailers are much MUCH more regulated there than here. Even a small trailer is required to have operational brakes (and I believe those brakes are required to be self actuating and not controlled by the tow vehicle) whereas here it's not at all uncommon to see a boat and trailer which weigh in excess of a ton and the trailer didn't even come with brakes . . . . not to mention that many trailers which do have brakes have never had them hooked up. You wouldn't get away with that for 10 miles over there But over here where we're blessed with $2 gas, what we drive evidently doesn't need to make much sense, hence the prevalence of trucks doing nothing more than taking one or two persons to work, school, shopping, church and back. To most of the rest of the world, driving a truck when you have so little need for it makes absolutely no sense Of course, there are all sorts of trucks which truly earn a living every day, but here in the USA that amounts to a very small percentage of the pick-ups on the road. It's not at all unusual here to find a 5 or 6 year old truck on a used lot and the bed of the truck looks brand new - It's hardly ever been used to tote things too big of too heavy to carry in a car and it doesn't even have a trailer hitch!! Anyone who has driven anywhere here in the USA would have to admit that the vast majority of pick-ups are being driven around empty with only 1 or 2 passengers - Something you can easily do in a car that costs half as much and gets twice (or 3X) the fuel economy To each his own as to what to buy. For more than 30 years, my #1 criteria when car shopping has always been to look at vehicles which will give me at least 30 miles to a gallon of gas - Oh, I can put up with 20 when it's towing a 1500 pound trailer, but that's 5 or 10% of the time - As opposed to getting 12 or 15 mpg all the time when I only need the capability of the truck 5 to 10% of the time Yes, I think for a $25 fee, Lowes will deliver most anything I buy to my house, but for three or 4 boards that essentially doubles the price of my lumber. No matter what I've bought, the $25 fee just seems excessive because Lowes is less than 4 miles from my house, so if I go pick things up myself, I can stop on the way home and get a free $25 tank of gas instead of paying for a delivery We're still getting used to our TC - It's by far the largest vehicle we've ever owned, but it's also the most luxurious. It's turning out to be a great vehicle for long distance travel, *and* it hauls both of our Segway I2's when we go. Around town, we have a pair of Mitsubishi all electric EV's that we use. We never have to buy any gas unless we're headed out of town on a trip Happy New Year to all you TC owners out there!! Don

test, test, test

It's all about how you will use your vehicle . . . . 90 or 95% of the time. Not everyone seems to agree with me . . . . I see crew cab pick-ups driving around all the time with a just a single person and most of those trucks haven't hauled or towed anything in many thousands of miles. They evidently don't mind 10 to 12 mpg in their 'daily driver' which maybe 5 or 10% of the time needs to haul or tow something If you need a family hauler which you would like to tote a motorcycle in 5% of the time, buy the family hauler (it's the correct vehicle for you 95% of the time, right?) and borrow, rent or buy a trailer for the bikes - I'm a 'bikes guy' too, but if I drive my TC 75,000 miles in the next 6 years, maybe 2,500 of those would be hauling a bike . . . . if it would fit in there, which it won't. You guessed it . . . . I use a bike trailer No single vehicle is perfect for everything you'd like to be able to do, but if you can find one that's excellent for what you do 90 or 95% of the time, that's the 'right' vehicle and you just gotta do something else to cover the other 5 or 10% We bought the 2014 SWB model partly because it doesn't have the taller roof . . . . I wouldn't need THAT 95% of the time and it just hurts mileage (plus it just looks dorky) but the main reason was for the newer drivetrain. The 6 speed select shift automatic which gets me 28 to 30 mpg on the freeway was more important 95% of the time. I didn't need the 3rd row seating, so we got the SWB which makes it easier to maneuver and park So, what am I missing 5% of the time now with the TC you might ask? Our little Mazda Protégé 5 wagon that the TC replaced had a roof rack and I could haul 16 foot 2 by 6's home strapped to the rack. Can't do that in the TC as it has no rack. Oh, I know it could have a rack, but I would only use it maybe 5% of the time and it would just be up there empty, whistling in the wind and killing my mileage the other 95% of the time, so I've just gotta make other arrangements for the 2 by 6's. Luckily, I sold the Mazda to the lady across the street and she will lend it to me if I need it . . . . and I'll lend her the TC if she needs it Unfortunately, nothing's perfect for every use . . . . and many times if you try really hard to find something that is - You wind up with something that's not practical most of the time Don

Would these work? https://www.amazon.com/LUYED-Lumens-Extremely-Chipsets-Brightest/dp/B01LWSFFF5/ref=sr_1_11?s=automotive&ie=UTF8&qid=1483132090&sr=1-11&keywords=amber+led+turn+signal+lights Don

What did you use to replace the turn signal bulbs? Don

Thanks for the GREAT write-up and photos! I'm sure this will help many folks down the line Don

Good thought! - It may be more useful than I thought I would *bet* that all sorts of things really *are* programmable, but 98% of the techs in our dealerships just don't know how and aren't really interested in learning. My passenger window would only roll up or down about an inch and a half with each press of the button when I bought it used - It took 6 or 7 presses to roll all the way down or back up. Took it in and the dealer diagnosed it as a defective window motor. They ordered the motor (took 2 days) and replaced it . . . . same problem! They did eventually fix the problem which I suspect required several phone calls to a 'higher authority' to learn how to reprogram something Don

We bought a 2014 SWB wagon and we had to really hunt to find exactly what we wanted - Most wagon versions are LWB 7 passenger models it seems. In the end, we had to drive 350 miles, across 2 states to find a dealer who had what we wanted *but* this really worked to our advantage in the end - The dealer had the van on his lot for more than a year and couldn't sell it, so in June of 2015 he licensed and titled it and used it for a dealer courtesy vehicle for a year. In June of 2016, he put it on his used car lot and again, nobody wanted to buy it, so we were able to negotiate a really good deal on it, even from 350 miles away - We bought it with 13,000 miles on if for $12K off the sticker price Why a SWB model? Several reasons. We both prefer small cars and this is by far the largest vehicle we've ever owned. I didn't want a HUGE vehicle to try to back, park and maneuver in tight spaces. We frequently haul 3 grandkids, so we need enough room for that, but we almost never need a 6th seat and the third row seating in the LWB models isn't the best design anyway - If we had bought a LWB model, we would probably have tossed the third row seats just to gain some cargo room behind the second row seats. With the SWB model, even with the seats up, we have plenty of room behind them . . . . actually a good bit more than in a LWB model with the 3rd row seating. When it's just the two of us taking a long trip (and this is what we REALLY bought it for) we can either fold and tumble the rear seats *or* we can flip the levers and completely remove the rear seats and leave them at home - Can you do that with a LWB model?? I much prefer the smaller side doors and I really LOVE the liftgate, which came as a total a surprise because we began with both of us thinking we would prefer the twin doors. The liftgate is HUGE and up high enough for even a 6 footer to comfortably stand under it . . . . and it's really nice to stand under when it's raining and you're loading/unloading. The twin rear doors fold nicely out of the way, but they also have a big blindspot right in the middle which really limits visibility from the rear view mirror and driving a big vehicle with limited rear visibility isn't something either of us was comfortable doing - Our test drive in a van version with the twin doors quickly revealed that we did NOT want the twin doors It turned out to be quite hard to find a white SWB 2014 (didn't want a 2013 or any earlier model because we really wanted the Select Shift 6 speed trans) wagon with the liftgate - Either they didn't make very many of them, or those who bought them liked them well enough that they aren't showing up on the used market. In the end, we got one which had it's 36 month, 36,000 mile warranty started in June of 2015, so our warranty will run through May of 2018 and we should be right near the 36,000 miles by that time. Coupled with the low miles, the really great price, this vehicle has really been a win-win for us. Our first 'big car' and we'll probably own it until we drive the wheels off of it Don

$450K 'bare bones' and $500K well equipped . . . . ooh, and you must put 50% down to get your name on the list! Don

I replaced the headlights on my 2014 TC today. First, as a credit to Ford (and probably because our TC's were all built in Europe) every stock halogen bulb in my wagon was made by Osram, which in my book is the best overall OEM bulb of them all. My standard upgrade on my other cars has always been to order me a new set of higher performance Osram's straight from Germany - Beware of ordering them from China and if you buy them locally, check to see that they're not from China. Like many other brand names, there are both a genuine article and Chinese knock-offs which are always inferior. The ones that came out of the car say 'Germany' right on them Fifty150 ordered a set of Street Cat LED H11's from Amazon and they are unlike any LED replacements I've ever seen. First, they came with a 'driver' which accepts any voltage from 9 VDC to 36 VDC and outputs exactly the correct stabilized voltage and current for the LED chips, no matter how much the input voltage may vary. This has got to make for both a brighter, more even light and a longer lasting bulb. Second, his replacements have a built-in 8,000 RPM fan which cools the LED chips. Again, this has got to increase the life of the bulbs IIRC he got a closeout price on the 2015 version rated at 4,000 lumens and 6000K color which is bright white, but not too far into the blue spectrum. A standard halogen bulb is around 1,350 to 1,500 lumens and the color is quite yellow, usually around 3000K. I bought the 2016 version of the Street Cat H11's which are now advertised to use Philips brand chips and they are now rated at 4,800 lumens or a bit more than triple the amount you get from an equivalent H11 halogen bulb. This isn't to say that you'll have triple the light down the road because other factors limit the useful light, but they are noticeably brighter . . . . and whiter A link to the ones I bought - https://www.amazon.com/Headlight-Conversion-Upgraded-version-Philips/dp/B01LXO0W17/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1481579843&sr=8-2&keywords=street+cat+h11 They are not a 10 minute install, IMO - We spent at least an hour in total, but then I was changing both high and low beams. The space inside the dust cap is small and my fingers are large, but I managed to get them inserted correctly and my wife was able to twist them to lock them in the headlight. I mounted the little driver boxes nearby with double stick trim tape. Like Fifty150 I left the dust caps off - I think you could probably cut a notch in them to allow the wires to come out (necessary because the driver won't fit inside) and get the dust caps back on, but with them off the ventilation must be better and the LED assembly with fan is rated as waterproof For the high beams, which are 65 watt H-9's I opted to replace those with PIAA Xtreme White halogens. *Supposedly* these give you 120 watts of light from just 65 watts of power which makes it sound like they are almost twice as bright (I take that with a few grains of salt) and they are 4150K in color, which is very white for a halogen bulb. These are popular replacements because they are so powerful and so white, but in low beam applications many reviewers report they only last for a year or two. I don't think I would choose them for your low beams (They cost about the same as the LED's anyway) but for high beam use, they should last a long time. We'll see. They *are* quite white . . . . nearly as white as the LED's to the naked eye The LED's do light up the road much better - Low beams don't appear to reach much (if any) farther than before - It does look like I could raise them just a bit and I probably will, but the amount of light on the road in front of me is noticeably increased. The high beams are just . . . . WOW! They really do reach farther and are much brighter than before. They light up everything! I'll get some pictures from out on the road and post them in the next few days - So far I'm very happy with the upgrade. Probably the best $100 I've spent on it so far Don

I seldom need to carry anything on the roof - 3 or 4 times a year to Lowes to buy 4 x 8 sheets of something or some 12 or 14 ft lengths of lumber. The price and complexity of the various roof rack systems has me thinking I may just do it the 'simple, DIY way' which will cost me less than $100 and be very quickly removable. I thought I'd better ask here to see if anyone can think of why this may not work?? What I'm thinking of is, remove either 4 or 6 of the plugs in the roof, permanently install 4 or 5 inch pieces of 5/16ths stainless threaded rod, using stainless nuts and washers above and below the roof, with rubber O rings between the roof and the washers, both on the underside and on top. A light coating of clear silicone before tightening things up. This would leave me with 2 1/2 or 3 inch stubs sticking up from the roof - Probably next to invisible unless you were looking for them. Should not be difficult to make them waterproof and since I wouldn't be drilling any holes, it would be completely reversible - Just keep the plugs I remove in the glovebox For crossbars, a piece of standard Unistrut, 60 inches long. Drill holes to match the stubs on the roof, install with a jam nut below and a nut on top - 5 or 10 minutes to put on a pair of crossbars (or 3 bars if needed) and then I would have a 60 inch wide set of bars to lash anything to. A big plus is there are all sorts of things which bolt onto Unistrut if I needed side bars or special things to clamp or bolt things on to. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Genuine-Unistrut-P1000-1-5-8-12-Gauge-Steel-Strut-Channel-Solid-Back-Pre-Gal-/201737745152?hash=item2ef881b300:g:7xkAAOSwiDFYQyUw I used Unistrut for all sorts of things when installing electronics on military bases and it's quite strong and very versatile. The only (small) downside I can see to this 'plan' is that I'll always have the 5/16ths 'stubs' sticking up out of the roof, but they'll only be 2 or 3 inches tall and they're stainless so they won't rust - Too small to make lots of wind noise?? Hope so! What do you guys think?? Don

The LRR (Low Rolling Resistance) tires do seem to last a bit longer, in addition to the added MPG's they give you. We have similar tires on our EV's and they really do increase range, which in a gas powered vehicle means better mileage. I will probably stick with the OEM Continentals when the time comes, but then it's a long way off - My 17,000 mile tires still look pretty much new Don

Think you posted that enough times there Fifty150?? I'm used to the links in your posts bring two feet long vertically . . . . thankfully you don't post most of them more than once!! Don

I was in the same boat a couple months ago - I was installing a new Pioneer radio on my '14 TC and I just wanted to find which wires did what, so I could install it the same way I had done on so many cars in the old days - I did eventually got it working kinda, sorta, a little bit but not really, but it was far from satisfactory and I eventually had to tear it out and start all over . . . . after buying the custome harness for my van The problem is . . . . these new cars and vans are all CanBus controlled. One wire I was looking for was the key switched +12 volts which turns on the radio when you start the car. Long story short, there is no such wire - The CanBus turns the radio on and it keeps it on after you shut off the car and until you open a door and then it shuts off and it's not using a 12 volt signal to do it. My new Pioneer radio also needed a Vss speed signal and a Reverse signal and also a Parking brake signal and none of those exist as stand alone wires either - The OEM radio gets those signals from the CanBus and my new radio needed to get them the same way, because there is no other way I'm sure the very idea of paying $50 or $75 for a harness to install your aftermarket radio is not something you think is worth the money, but in a new car it's just about the only way you *CAN* install an aftermarket radio . . . . and anyway, it will save you $75 worth of time, trouble and FRUSTRATION trying vs trying to do it the old fashioned way Me? I'm dense - I spent a dozen very frustrating hours taking the dash apart and putting it back together again several times trying to do it the old fashioned way and *THEN* I had no choice, so I spent the money for the harness - I coulda, shoulda just bought the harness in the first place . . . . but I'm old and stubborn You could take it to a stereo install shop and they'll charge you $150 to do the install . . . . and $75 of that will be for the harness and the other $75 will be for the 20 minutes it takes them to do the job . . . . with the correct harness Don

I agree - More sidewall height would be preferable to less On my last vehicle, I swapped the 195/50-16 tires for 205/55-15's and got a much better ride with no loss in handling that I could detect. It began because I already had a set of very lightweight BBS alloys I really liked the look of on the car and I wanted to keep the tire diameter and circumference the same as stock. Worked out very well and I would do the same on my TC if I could . . . . maybe I can? If not, I'll stick with the 16's as going to 17's with a lower sidewall could only make the ride worse Don

I'm not exactly sure as to what they are telling you. It could be that they are assuming you want the OEM camera to display on your Pioneer and that's not possible. As it was explained to me, the OEM camera is digital and the Pioneer wants to display an analog signal so they're not compatible. Take that with a grain of salt though, as I've been told all sorts of things that turned out not to be true - The Crutchfield 'expert' told me there was no available harness which kept my OEM back-up camera, but that turned out to be wrong I'm 99% sure the XSVI-5524-NAV harness will install your Pioneer correctly and retain the stock back up camera . . . . . but I'm not sure if adding the ASWC-1 harness to retain your steering wheel controls will keep the camera functioning or not - Maybe not Worst case, adding the ASWC-1 harness to get the steering wheel controls operational costs you the OEM back up camera and you end up installing a new $50 camera and route it direct to the Pioneer My van did not come with OEM steering wheel controls, but I later installed a very nice OEM leather wrapped steering wheel which does have them, but because the van did not come with them, the computer isn't programmed for them to work - They didn't work with the OEM radio before I removed it and adding an aftermarket harness in an attempt to make them work didn't do the job with the Pioneer either. I'm fairly sure I can 'tag' the wires under the steering wheel and route them direct to the Pioneer and get them to work, but I haven't got around to confirming that yet Yes, your Bluetooth and Sirius will be a function of the Pioneer when you get it installed - New microphone and Sirius adapter will be required Good luck with your install and please post your results here - Every bit of new info will help the next guy Don

Interesting that Bikesnbreakdowns gained an inch of ground clearance just by going from a 205/65R15 to a 205/70R15. The 65 series tire is 25.5 inches in diameter while the 70 series is 26.3 inches in diameter - Just 0.8 inches larger in diameter, so the increase in ground clearance should have been only 0.4 inches Regardless, changing tire size to increase ground clearance isn't the way to go about it. Going to a tire large enough to make a significant difference will upset all sorts of things you really don't want to mess with. Forget the speedometer difference - You're effectively changing the gear ratio and that would mean you'd need to reprogram the transmission shift points to make the van drive as it was designed. A taller tire also means the brakes work harder and likely your stopping distance would also be increased If you need another inch or two of ground clearance, leave the gear ratios alone and lift the van by modifying the suspension and not by going to monster tires Don