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Everything posted by Doc Hoy
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So does anyone know what things the computer is programmed to "learn" about a new performance feature such as a replaced engine or performance impacting work done to an engine or to "relearn" perhaps even on a continuing basis? I have two data points about shift points: 1. I read several time (or listened to a video) that the computer relearns shift points 2. I know that the patterns in shifting of my 2012 1TC changed over a period of about four days after the motor was replaced. So in addition to shift points, what other things does the computer monitor and adjust for?
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Guys, I am thinking that is what happened. It makes sense given the performance chips marketed to improve the performance of engines through no other means than changing how the computer operates the engine. I had a 2003 BMW Z3M with a Dinan performance chip that added about 60 horse power. The downside is that it was too much power for the frame. It pulled the weldments for the differential carrier away from the frame. $3,000.00 repair.
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Update...... Performance of my 1TC with the replaced engine has changed. It now runs exactly (to my ability to compare) the same as the 2011 1TC. I don't have to be careful not to break the tires loose any more. It doesn't drop into a lower gear so quickly when accelerating at speed anymore. It doesn't seem to have substantially more power than the 2011 any more. There are still no alerts on the dash. Sounds right. Seems to be fine. I only have one potential explanation: When I was reading the articles on the internet about swapping the injectors, I read several times about removing the battery cables from the battery and shorting them together to discharge capacitors in the computer allowing the computer to "relearn the shift points for the transmission." When I did this after the injector change, I did note the process of the computer learning the shift points. Seemed to be a little off for the first coupla dozen miles, then settled down to good even performance. So I am wondering if there are other things the computer has to "learn" about a new engine. Maybe mixture, or timing advance. Anyone smart on the computer?
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GBL....Don't know. The engine seems to interface with the computer properly. No odd alerts and such. 150.... Agree and that would have to be true of the other 1TC I own and operate daily. The two trucks had essentially identical performance before the 2012 began to act up. BTW, I got them mixed up in my lead in post. The 2012 is the one with the engine swapped out. The 2011 will less miles on it runs fine. Sorry for the confusion.
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I originally put this is the wrong topic. I have a 1TC which was giving me fits which finally wound up as a top end problem. I opted for an engine swap from a wrecked Focus. When I got the truck back, it had substantially more power than the original motor (when it worked properly) and substantially more power than my 2012 1TC. In doing some reading, I have learned that the 2.0 Duratec motor came in two versions. 1 produced 136 HP and the other produced 140 HP. But the improvement in performance of this 1TC can't be explained by a mere four HP. So are there other versions of the 2.0 or the later 2.3 that fit in this truck that are hotter engines? I can break the tires loose on this truck from a standing start. I am having to be careful not to twist an axle or hose up the transmission.
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In another thread, I spent months whining about my poor running 1TC, 2011. Final outcome was an engine swap with a Focus engine but I do not know the origin of the engine. Only that it has 86K on it which implies it might have come from a more recent car than 2011. There is only good news, here: After the engine swap, I find that my TC has substantially more power than my second 1TC (2012 with 190k 0n it). It also has substantially more power than the 2012 1TC while it was still running right with the old engine. In the reading that I did, I find that the 2.0 Duratec only had two versions. One with 136 HP and the other with 140 HP. But the increase in performance can't be attributed to a four HP increase. Question: Is there another 2.0 Duratec out there that I don't know about? One that produces more than 140 HP? Does the 2.3 engine interchange with the 2.0? And might I have a 2.3 liter engine in the 1TC?
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David, I will second the "Woot Woot". I have two of these things and they are good work horses. Good thing because I can't afford to change now. Unfortunately the old motor is already gone and the injectors and coils with it. The throttle body and MAF sensor was used in my truck as they did not come with the motor. I do have the injectors I took out of it three weeks ago and no reason to believe there is anything wrong with them. To GBL, Yes. Zakly. But this time I was allowing myself to be lead down the primrose path with some info that did not add up. To 150, Every word of your post could be sited to summarize my hesitancy with the Ford dealership. I don't really know their specific work quality but I don't intend to find out. When I learned that this general mechanic had extensive experience with Ford and some good experience with 1TC, I had everything I needed to make the decision. The guy who is in the shop that fixed it told me all of the OBDII codes should be the same. What I mean to say is that the OBDII reader should not be confused by the fact that the engine is not original even if it is a Focus engine. He did not know if the motor came out of a TC or out of a Focus. Tnx, Barry
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In the immortal words of Popeye the sailor, "Ghuuugh, This is embaraskin." When I opened this thread, I was really stuck. I had a 1TC which was running just like it had slightly uneven compression, problem with spark, or problem with fuel on two of four cylinders. I swapped out the plugs and coils, thinking that an engine with over 200k might need it (or more correctly...deserve it). No change. Bought a code reader and did not get anything but "Multiple misfires". Took it to mechanic with prolly forty years experience and a very successful shop. He did not note a compression problem in the engine but also got multiple misfires with an occasional hit on 2 and 3. Swapped out the injectors and still no change. Mentioned it to y'all and one of the first questions to me was essentially, "Are you positive that compression is even on all cylinders?" My response was in the affirmative and that is the embaraskin part. I happen to be good friends with a car resale business owner. (One of the honest ones). She and I were just speaking one day and she mentioned that she had a new mechanic who because of a Navy transfer had to leave a Ford dealership and was working for her until the local dealership had an opening. He took a look at the TC for me and within an hour had found slightly low compression on the center two cylinders. To just about everyone who responded with your help, I apologize. I was wrong, everyone of you was right. ;o(. He offered two options. 1. Take the truck to machine shop and have the top end rebuilt. 2. Swap the engine. Didn't want to rebuild the top end, because I would spend a lot of money and have an engine with over 200k and a rebuilt top end (How soon do the mains go?) Mechanic found an engine in a wreck with under 90k on it. The price was an amazing (to me) 250.00 plus 1600.00 to swap it out. Got the truck back and it runs like new.
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Yes. Found that out. In fact I have just bought a second scanner (Foseal ELM327) which will work with an iPad rather than incorporating a display as part of the design. I was initially hesitant about my iPhone or iPad getting to look like the oil pan but after using the Ancel, I realize that the use of the scanner has two phases. 1. Do the readings. 2. Work on the truck. Then it repeats as the repair action continues. Plenty of opportunity to wash my hands before handling my phone or iPad. iPad never leaves the seat of the truck. Never handled by greasy hands.
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Willygee, I took the thing to the shop and will hear back from them this week as to what the actual fix will be. Long time to work on it but they are behind because of a long closure during the recent storm. I am at the wrong end of the backlog. More later.
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150, Yes...Thanks for the info. Trying to isolate the misfire problem has forced me to first buy the scanner and then use it to the minimal amount my brain can assimilate. I'll get better over time. The user manual is not great. But I'll get it worked out. I am going to watch the video that GBL suggested again.
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I also changed the throttle body, throttle position sensor and MAF sensor. Here again, I was not in much hope of making the symptoms go away. I did it because the parts were cheap. The job was easy and I was already under the hood. Indeed it did improve performance a little but not enough to say it is fixed.
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Back to the injectors. With the fuel rail off and out the way, it is a simple matter to pull each injector out of the head. It takes a little doing but eventually they all came out. No need to pry on them. No need to get after then with any tools. Image 1 is old and new injectors The remanufactured injectors came with seals but not with clips and so I needed to salvage those from the old injectors. They are darned hard to get off. I wound up putting each injector in a soft jaw vise just tight enough to hold it in place. Then pushed the clips off with a screwdriver. Image two is injector in vise. This process worked without damage to any of the injectors. Injectors went back into the engine fairly easily as well. I put a little grease on the seals so as to permit them to slide into the hole in the head without damaging the seal. Grease on the top seal as well. It appears these are designed to only slide into the head and into the fuel rail just so far. Then the tightening of the bolts in the fuel rail (when the fuel rail is finally reinstalled over the injectors) finishes the job of seating the injector in the cylinder head and in the fuel rail. I snugged the bolts down and reconnected to plugs on each injector. Put the fuel pump fuse back in place and replaced the fuse box cover. I shorted out the PCM so it could relearn the shift points (Not certain this is needed for this maintenance action.) Job complete. Truck still runs rough but I was pretty sure it would since injectors had already been eliminated as a source of problem.
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Yep, That I can do.
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Okay......Very informative.
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I tried removing the fuel rail and injectors as a unit but was unsuccessful. I could feel the injectors moving in the cylinder head and I could also feel the top of the injectors moving in the fuel rail. But I just could not get enough purchase on the fuel rail to dislodge the injectors from the cylinder head. So I surrendered and decided to remove the rail and then pull the injectors individually. The injectors are held in place in the fuel rail by a clip at the top of the injector which engages a flange on the rail. Image 1. These clips are disengaged from the rail by prying outward with a screwdriver so as to get a tab on the clip to disengage from a flange on the rail. In the image you can see the two sides of the clip. These clips are quite stubborn. You need to be able to simultaneously pry outward on both sides of the clip whilst pulling on the fuel rail to move it off of the top of the injector. Ford probably makes a tool to open both sides of the clip at one time (Or, they have hired a bunch of Turkish mechanics with three hands.). The clip will remain on the top of the injector and once you figure out how to open both sides of the clip at the same time, you can pull the rail off just enough to clear the tabs on the clip. Start at one end (I recommend the left end as you view the engine.) So with the clip on the injector to the left disengaged from the fuel rail, you can move to the next clip in line and slowly you will have them all disengaged from their respective injectors. If there is a frustrating part of the project, the removal of the fuel rail is it. Still, it appears to be a better method than trying to pry all of the injectors out simultaneously. (Method 1) I simply could not do it, but you may be able to. I included image 2 as a better view of the clips on top of the injectors. Old injectors with clips in the top row and new injectors sans clips in the bottom row. Image 3 may be helpful in understanding the interaction of the clips with the injectors and the rail. The top of the clip (remember...You are looking at the photo with the clip upside down) must be pushed outward in the direction of the red arrow. At rest it is in the position indicated by the red profile. It must be pushed out until it disengages the flange on the fuel rail as shown in the yellow profile. You have to do this to both sides of the clip on that injector until the clip completely disengages the rail on both sides of the flange. Then, you have to pull the fuel rail away from the injector. Good luck. CAUTION: Don't lose or discard these clips. Be careful not to damage them during removal. My set of injectors did not come with clips. I needed them. Image 4, shows the fuel rail completely removed and positioned out of the way.
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Image 1 is of the injector connectors removed. Squeeze the clip on the side of the connect and pull it off. Inside the red oval, you will see the plug positioned next to the injector it was intended to feed. Don't worry about getting the plugs back on in the right sequence. The wiring harness routs them in such a way that it is hard to reconnect them incorrectly. The injectors are held in place with the fuel rail. Images 1, 3, and 4 also shows the fuel rail bolts. These are 10 mm. I squirted them with Kroil before trying to remove them. After about five minutes they turned right out. Images 2 and 5. Sorry about the sequence of these photos. I had them right but I think the software likes them in a different sequence. Once you get the bolts out, you will feel the injectors moving in the cylinder head and in the fuel rail sockets. You now have a decision to make: 1. Pull the injectors while they are still connected to the fuel rail. 2. Remove the fuel rail from the top of the injectors and pull them individually. I use method two, although I have read stuff on the internet which leads me to believe that others have used method 1.
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Changed Injectors today. I looked for a procedure on the internet for a while but was unable to find one specifically for the 1TC. So I am posting this here. This is a 2012 1TC with gas engine. For most of you this will be of no value since you have probably changed enough of these that it is old hat. I am going to do this in several different post so that it is easier for me to compose the narrative. It may not be completed in one sitting so please be tolerant. For those of you who have a manual or who have done this before, please wade in with correction/improvements. The entire process only took about an hour. Image 1 is top of engine with arrows showing location of injectors. Good idea to pull the fuse which protects the fuel pump. On mine this was fuse number 4. Engine should be running. When you pull the fuse the fuel pump stops pressurizing the line. The engine will use the fuel in the lines the lines are depressurized. I still had a bit of fuel in the lines which got onto the top of the engine. Here is a link to a site which has the diagram of the fuse box. https://fuse-box.info/ford/ford-transit-connect-2010-2013-fuses-and-relay Be careful. If you try to download the PDF, you get hoodwinked into downloading a "Downloader". You don't need it. Just save the page. It has a good diagram of the cabin fuse box and the engine compartment fuse box (which is the one you are looking for.) Image 2 is of the fuse box with fuse 4 removed. In order to get the fuse box cover off and out of the way, you need to take the ground strap loose from its landing point in front of the fuse box. It is held in place with the grey clip and pulls off rather easily. The fuse box cover also comes off pretty easily. One snap on either end. Image 3.
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I received and am fooling with my scanner. It is an inexpensive ANCEL AD410 for which I paid less than 40.00 and I am happy with it (I think). My question is not about this specific scanner but about scanners in general. I want to verify my knowledge of how these things work. Conceptually, the scanner is connected to the port and the car/truck is running. The scanner reads the vehicles VIN (If it has the capability and mine does) and from the VIN the scanner knows what parameters it will be able to read. It then senses the parameters and if something fall outside of acceptable limits, the vehicle will generate an error/fail test code which the scanner can then present to the user. In my case, the scanner appears to automatically present not just the code but also the title of the failed test. I can also use my scanner to step through various tests of the performance of the truck. So it doesn't just provide data on things that are wrong. It allows me to run tests on other performance. BUT I don't know what the data will tell me about the performance of the truck. Are these test titles pretty much standard? Are the tests standard but are the titles vehicle specific? (Does Ford call the test of the catalytic converter one thing and Chevy call it something else?) Once I know the parameter that is being measured, how do I know which system in the truck is being tested? I like this scanner (as I would probably like any similarly priced scanner) but my sense is that I am only using it at about 5% effectiveness
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So far I am happy with the manual that I downloaded from Tradebit. Admittedly that is probably because I don't do much work on the trucks. I wish I had more time to fiddle with these two trucks. If I can't fond it on the manual I look for an online video or ask questions here. If that doesn't help, I am pretty much stuck.
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Scanner has live data but I have to get better at using it. I don't have a gauge for testing pressure drop across the converter.
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More good service from this manual. Needed to take a look at what the TC looks like with the front bumper cover off. The manual told me what I wanted to know. The more I use it the happier I get.
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After a little fooling around, I have come to the realization that the information provided by my scanner is not a complete match to the info described by my mechanic as coming from his scanner. While he described codes indicating more or less consistent misfire on 2 and 3 I am getting only "Multiple Misfire" and no repeated reference to a specific cylinder or cylinders. I did get a specific cylinder on one reading and that was number 2. I am not certain if: 1. His scanner is providing better information because it is a better scanner 2. He is not communicating well when describing his scanners results to me 3. His scanner is interpreting engine performance in a way that is so accurate that it is reporting performance which is not actually contributing to my problem 4. I am too dumb about using my scanner I have resolved to take the truck to the Ford dealership as soon as I can be without it for a while. In the mean time I have ordered injectors, a MAF sensor and a throttle body. I will put these in before a take it to Ford. I will change these things because they are; inexpensive and relatively easy to change, questionable in a truck that has 220k miles on it, might contribute to the poor performance of the truck as their operation is described in the manual. My hopes are not high but I am giving it a try. BTW, the injector cleaner and Cataclean did not help. No such thing as "mechanic in a can" Tnx, Doc
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I got my scanner about three days early so I messed with it a bit this evening. I cleared the emission system codes and they stayed off but I imagine they will be back on by tomorrow evening. I read the engine codes and found a Random Multiple Misfire code. I have a fail on number 2 but that only happened once in about three minutes. No other individual cylinder codes coming up. Now I do not get a code on any individual cylinders. I might add that I read codes on my other 1TC and got no codes and the dashboard reflects no codes. I dumped a can of Sea Foam into the gas tank (full) in the hopes of getting (or keeping) the fuel system clear. We shall see. So far, I like the scanner. Easy to use. Senses the VIN. I have to get better at using it to really tell if it is helpful. As I only paid 40 bucks for it , I don't feel too bad. Tnx, Doc
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Bought some Cataclean and some injector cleaner on today. Monday. As soon as I get a moment free I will try the Cataclean. I'll wait on the injector cleaner. I will not use them at the same time. I am really anxious to try this Code Reader. I did a good bit of comparison between the low cost (under a hundred) readers available. According to the various write-ups, the Ancel 410 came out slightly on top. All of the write-ups are vague on how comprehensive the readers are in terms of the data they return. It came down to a couple of unimportant factors: Screen size and characteristics or data presentation. Length of the cable. Front panel controls. Speed of delivery to my mailbox. Finally price. The Ancel was the most expensive but on top in all other categories. The rest of this week is monumentally busy at the restaurant so it won't be until prolly Monday but I'll give y'all a report on how I like it.
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