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We were shopping for a SWB van to travel in, but we were kinda put off by the 'sparse' interior - I figured it would have to be harder to heat and cool and probably a bit noisier at freeway speeds too But then, we got to thinking that occasionally, one or more of the grandkids would like to go with us on a trip and trying to fashion a safe and legal seat in the back of the van would be difficult, to say the least, so we started looking at wagons with the rear seats. Unfortunately, not one sales rep at any dealer we checked knew a darned thing about the TC wagons - We especially wanted to know how difficult it would be to remove the rear seats for the times we didn't need them, or when they were taking up space we needed for something else. "I suppose you could probably find some way to unbolt them and take them out" was the best advice we got We eventually found the 'right' TC SWB wagon - A used 2014 with only 13K on it and almost 2 years of the 3 year, 36K warranty left and we were able to buy it for $10.5K off the sticker. As it turns out, the rear seatbacks fold flat, then if you need more space, they lift vertically to stow just behind the front buckets and if that's still not enough space, they lift completely out of the van in 30 seconds using no tools at all. You can take out the larger one or the smaller one separately or you can remove them both. At the price for this barely used one, it was much cheaper than a new cargo van . . . . and this one has leather power seats. It took us over 6 weeks to find the right one and we had to travel 400 miles to bring it home, but it was really worth the wait Don