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CrawfordArt

Can second row seats be installed in cargo models?

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I'm looking at getting a transit connect XLT 2010-2013 and ideally I'd like it to have a second row seating I'd be able to remove when transporting cargo. However I'm having better luck finding the cargo vans without said seat. Is it possible to install the second row seats to the cargo model?

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Those years have the false floor welded in (search the forum here, there are already many posts about it), so you'd have to cut out that section to open up the 'footwell' for the seats. Even some of the 2nd-gen 2014's were welded in, but then they smartly switched to bolted-in panels which a few of us gen-2 folks have removed completely or modified for storage wells. 

 

All the threaded bolt holes are already present in the floor & body, so the OEM seat and belts (junkyard?) will physically bolt-in after you open up that footwell. Some of the bolt holes are inside the footwell, so leaving the false floor in-place wouldn't be an option. But, then the seat would fold down 'flat' like in the wagon version. Some people have even come up with DIY second row seats, one guy has just a 3rd seat that mounts on Unistrut that's bolted to the floor and can be removed in a minute or two. 

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The 2014 and newer short wheelbase passenger vans have 60/40 second row seats which are very easy to remove and reinstall  -  They were designed for exactly what you want to do.  You flip a couple levers and each piece lifts out separately.  Removal takes less than 5 minutes and reinstalling them is just as simple.  Another plus, if you need more space but don't want to go to the hassle of removing them, the seatbacks fold down flat and then the entire seat can be 'flipped' up vertically and they rest against the backs of the front buckets  -  The rear seat headrests end up in the footwell.  You only gain about an extra 8 inches or so by removing them completely.  Unfortunately, this feature is only in the SWB models, as the LWB models with 3rd row seating have completely different seats

 

Don

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21 hours ago, CrawfordArt said:

I'm looking at getting a transit connect XLT 2010-2013 and ideally I'd like it to have a second row seating I'd be able to remove when transporting cargo. However I'm having better luck finding the cargo vans without said seat. Is it possible to install the second row seats to the cargo model?

Yes. You can bolt in many aftermarket seats, or source the OEM seats. Be sure you get seatbelts if local laws require it.

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1 hour ago, Double Nickels said:

Yes. You can bolt in many aftermarket seats, or source the OEM seats. Be sure you get seatbelts if local laws require it.

 

You can bolt in most anything, but would they be legal?  What if someone was injured while riding in your owner installed seats . . . . could they sue you?  How easy would they be to remove if you wanted to haul something?  If they're bolted through the floor, likely they'd take so long to remove and reinstall that you'd probably never think of taking them out, which isn't what he's looking for

 

Don

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You don't need extra permission for that?

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Best to check with local highway patrol 1st.

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On 3/20/2020 at 2:12 PM, Fifty150 said:

Best to check with local highway patrol 1st.

 

Ask three different state cops and you'll get four or five different answers! They are not an encyclopedia of laws and really only know the most commonly enforced laws by memory - something as rare as regulations (if any!) about adding seats to a cargo van will NOT be their forte. If you're that damned worried, go pay an upfitter or conversion company to do a "professional" conversion, since they're certified, licensed & insured for such conversions. But, as long as your added seat doesn't fail during an accident (separate itself from the vehicle floor/structure), what in the world would your passenger sue you for?? 

 

@Daniel-J, US laws are nothing like Aussie laws & inspections, so no we don't really need "permission" or paperwork or post-install inspections. 

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I spent 3 years stationed in Germany  -  Automotive laws and inspections are night and day different from what we have in any state in the US

 

One example  -  They have a law that the entire wheel and tire must be covered by the fenders.  At the inspection station, they stand a yardstick beside the tire and if it touches the tire sidewall at the bottom and the top of the tire, but doesn't touch the fender, then the tire is considered not covered by the fender and the car fails.  The car I drove while I was over there was a Datsun 240Z which had dealer upgraded alloy wheels installed on it when new (stock was steel wheels) with standard size tires on them.  The tire did not touch any part of the fender or body, even when flexed to maximum . . . . the tire went up fully into the fender well without rubbing anywhere if you jacked any corner of the car.  But . . . . when you stood a yardstick beside the tire, it touched the bottom and top sidewall and missed touching the fender lip by about 3/8ths of an inch . . . . so, it failed inspection.  I got it inspected annually the 3 years I was there and I had to borrow a set of wheels and tires from a buddy to get it to pass inspection

 

They test shocks, tires, lights and brakes, running the car on a dyno-like machine to test brakes.  If one wheel has just a few percent more or less braking power than it's adjacent wheel, if fails.  A rust hole the size of a nickle anywhere on the car, it fails.  The inspector literally does a chin up hanging from your exhaust system to test the hangers.  They plug up the tailpipe and the engine better die, or there's a leak somewhere.  A car that passes a German TUV inspection is in pretty darned good shape . . . . and you're free to drive it 175 mph down the autobahn if you like.  What you don't see over there are any junkers on the road and very few cars older than 8 or 10 years.  To get an older car through inspection, you've got to be maintaining it extremely well

 

Don

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On 3/4/2020 at 6:11 AM, jrm223 said:

Those years have the false floor welded in (search the forum here, there are already many posts about it), so you'd have to cut out that section to open up the 'footwell' for the seats. Even some of the 2nd-gen 2014's were welded in, but then they smartly switched to bolted-in panels which a few of us gen-2 folks have removed completely or modified for storage wells. 

 

All the threaded bolt holes are already present in the floor & body, so the OEM seat and belts (junkyard?) will physically bolt-in after you open up that footwell. Some of the bolt holes are inside the footwell, so leaving the false floor in-place wouldn't be an option. But, then the seat would fold down 'flat' like in the wagon version. Some people have even come up with DIY second row seats, one guy has just a 3rd seat that mounts on Unistrut that's bolted to the floor and can be removed in a minute or 


Hi there Im really hoping for more info about the false floor/seat anchors.   I’m not having any luck finding more threads beyond this one by searching this forum.  
 

I stumbled across a post on a ford truck forum saying that “non US” cargo models of 1st gen TC’s do NOT have the threaded bolt holes and socket/bar anchors hidden beneath the welded down false floor.  
 

I’m in Canada (see: non US) and this information has caused me to hit the brakes on purchasing a used 2013 TC Cargo.  The van would be useless to me if I couldn’t have at least one seat in the back for my kid.  
 

I have already bought a mint condition OEM 2nd row 60/40 split seat from a 2010 TC passenger wagon, with all the seatbelts and hardware.  I grabbed it knowing they aren’t all that common (I searched wreckers all over North America and found only one in Oregon and it was “mouldy and may or may not have a rat living in it”) and to get the ball rolling on the project.  
 

my next step was to acquire a 2010-13 TC Cargo, pull up and/or cut out the appropriate spots to expose the seat sockets and nutserts, plug in the second row seat and score a family man touchdown.  
 

But this new and disturbing information has given me cold feet.  If I were to purchase the used TC, cut in to the false floor and find that indeed there are not any spots to connect the seats because the Canadian models came from a different assembly process without the anchors and holes installed, I’d be in the doghouse for at least until after the next US election.   
 

I’ve spoken to almost every Ford dealership service department in my city, and its 50/50 - half saying the anchor points are “probably” under there, half saying don’t be so sure.   
 

Maybe I’m answering my own question here - but should I go ahead with the purchase, and just hope that the anchors are there, and if they’re not, sell the OEM seats (hopefully someone will want them) and buy a single aftermarket seat and have it bolted to the floor, as described by others?  A key function would be that it can fold down forward somewhat flat.  
 

thanks for the read.  Looking forward to any insight. 
 

neil

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Neil, I just did some searching of my own and was able to find this old photo album from another member. The pics aren't real great, though, and it doesn't show the areas where the mounting holes should be, so it still doesn't answer your questions.

 

I have a 2015 Gen 2, so I'm not able to help much beyond this. Is there a reason for y'all not buying a Gen 2 LWB? It seems that 2014 models are a mix of either welded-in or bolted-in (late in the model year) and all 15+ have the floor extension bolted-in & a few people here have put OEM second row seat into a G2 TC van without issue. The few G1 seat additions I've seen have all been aftermarket seats, as far as I can remember. One guy here on FTCF (I believe it's sKiZo) is planning to upgrade his G1 TC to have Focus ST or RS leather seats front & rear, but that's more custom modifications to do and won't fold-flat like a van seat. He also has a buddy with a custom vehicle fabrication shop helping with the van customization. 

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hey thanks for the reply jrm223

 

Upon some more scanning of similar forums, I found 2 or 3 posts confirming my fear - the 1st gen TC's that were imported to Canada were ordered as true cargo vans from the factory in Turkey.  The floors are definitely without the anchors, inserts, or even the nutserts.  Just plain, unmolested steel.  Huge bummer.  

 

Then as some incredible luck would have it, an excellent condition, low mileage, black in colour (!), 2010 Transit Connect Passenger Wagon that someone had imported from Seattle to Vancouver dropped on Craigslist.  I couldn't believe my eyes - and to make things just too weird...  It had no back seats!  The guy had removed them and used it for his business delivering flowers.  They were long gone - and here I was, destitute with nothing but a set of mint condition back seats for a vehicle I'd resigned to assuming I'd never find gets dropped in my lap just begging for it's beautiful seats to be returned.  (The passenger version was a flop in Canada, so they're basically a unicorn up here - nothing but cargo versions).  

 

I just put the seats in today with shocking ease, and shed a tear of joy.  The van goes in on Monday for all new motor mounts, which I understand is a notorious weak spot with these.  I know I could do it myself, just no time.  The total labour is like $120 (on top of the cost Ford OEM parts of course) so I'm happy to let them bash up their knuckles.

 

I couldn't be happier.  

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Sounds like you ought to buy yourself a Lotto ticket, while you're on a lucky streak! Haha

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